Subject: MN: Re: (fwd) London Underground Map

From: "Wayper, Paul" <WayperP@p...>
Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 11:04:52 +1000

On Friday, May 28, 1999 8:17 PM, kevan@d...
[SMTP:kevan@d...] wrote:
> Hmm. Maybe it's time to try and write that huge and impressive Mornomic
> Companion program that does all that sort of thing. In extremely belated
> response to a point of Paul's that never got an answer, I expect I could
> manage some sort of Map-mapping program (click on the Stations and it
> determines their coordinates, allowing Current and Quadrants and whatnot
> to be calculated fairly easily) if I had a computer; I still haven't
> gotten around to buying one myself, and Chrissy's has been lacking a
> monitor for a particularly long time, now.

I just had another idea for that. The total requirements are probably large
enough that I think we should look at donating some money to Kevan if he can
program it (I certainly will). It'd certainly be of use in the future
scheme of things, especially seeing that Zones (and Charge, perhaps) seem to
be an integral part of current play and foreign maps that don't use them are
quite a bit more boring to play. But that may just be my unfamiliarity with
the Paris Metro.

I think I last proposed the idea to Kevan privately, so it might be a good
idea to throw the idea open publicly and see what people can add:

* The program's function is to act as a database and calculator for rail
maps. You start with a bitmap image (of the rail map in question) and use
the program to generate data about the map.
* You start by loading the bitmap image, and then clicking on points on the
map corresponding to the locus of stations. The program will ask you to
enter the name of the station, although it will try to guess if you've
already input that station before (by distance).
* You can then create a branch (of a line) and then select the stations in
order that are on that branch. Branches get linked into lines - lines are
essentially trees of branches. Each branch will also remember the
interchange stations on it (as an attribute of the station leaf).
* By storing information about line colour, the program should then be able
to generate a rail map of the map in question at any resolution.
* Station location can then be used to generate lists of charges.
* By specifying an 'origin' station Quadrants can be generated.
* Zones can be created by specifying their perimeter polygon. This can then
be used to generate a list of stations in a Zone, and can also be used to
add zone colour overlay information in a map.
* By specifying a grid of horizontal and vertical lines, the station list
can then include a simple lookup (e.g. "Parsons Green : E3").
* All the information entered can be saved and loaded in a simple file
format.

What's a good rate, Kevan?

Paul Wayper -- DPI ITS Computer Systems Officer
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From: kevan@d...
Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 10:32:34 -0000

> program it (I certainly will).

Tish and tosh. Money is the least of my incentives; I already get more than I know what to do with from my proper employers (for the curious, a Millennium Bug tester that I partly wrote for them is downloadable from my Web page). Knowing that I'm doing something that's appreciated, and that I'm going to enjoy writing, are the only issues, really.

I'm hesitantly looking to buy some sort of home computer at the moment; when I've gotten hold of one (and if any UK people could recommend a good place to buy a reasonably unimpressive computer, I'd welcome it), I'll take a look at the thing in greater depth and see how much of it's feasible. I imagine it shouldn't be that awful to get working, and only slightly less awful to polish up to an impressive standard.

Kevan

--
kevan@d...
http://members.xoom.com/asabove

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From: "Snow" <snow@s...>
Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 18:02:28 +0100

PaulWay wrote:

> The program's function is to act as a database and calculator for
> rail maps. You start with a bitmap image (of the rail map in
> question) and use the program to generate data about the map.

Since the images from LU PDF files are vector graphics (you can 
see it build up on anything but the fastest of computers) it should 
be possible to rip the data straight out without waving mice about.

Unfortunately not. I did a bit of research the other day and 
discovered that Adobe only distributes its PDF library for 
applications that are "in alignment with Adobe's strategic 
directions". I don't think that extracting LU data from PDF maps 
counts.

I did manage to extract the station names and their locations using 
a tool I found on the net, but not the locations of the stations (I got 
the locations of the names, not the locations of the stations).

Anyway, even if one could rip the station locations one would still 
need to connect them with the station names.

So the bitmap option would seem to be better.

> I'm hesitantly looking to buy some sort of home computer at the moment;
> when I've gotten hold of one (and if any UK people could recommend a good
> place to buy a reasonably unimpressive computer, I'd welcome it), I'll
> take a look at the thing in greater depth and see how much of it's
> feasible. I imagine it shouldn't be that awful to get working, and only
> slightly less awful to polish up to an impressive standard.

How unimpressive? Secondhand in MicroMart you should be able 
to get a 486 for £50 or a slow Pentium for £100. Even a new PII can 
be found for less than £5-600 if your definition of "unimpressive" is 
significantly more impressive than mine.

Snow