Subject: ackanomic digest V3 #364
From: [email-masked] (ackanomic digest)
To: [email-masked]

ackanomic digest       Sunday, October 18 1998       Volume 03 : Number 364

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 00:15:23 -0400 (EDT)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Acka: Fore!

I give one of my Rocks to Wind A String Around to the Treasury, in exchange
for a Prosthetic Forehead, with the following description(delimited by
GODWIN AUSTEN):

GODWIN AUSTEN
This forehead is covered with the symbol of Chaos, the eight arrows
pointing in all the directions of the compass.  At the point from
which the arrows diverge is a spiral in purple and gold.
GODWIN AUSTEN

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.connect.ab.ca/~alfvaen/ )
Current Album--The Frantics:4 On The Floor
Current Book--Anne Rice:The Queen of The Damned
I tried to play the shoehorn.  All I got was footnotes.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 00:31:10 -0400 (EDT)
From: JT <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Web Pages.

On Sat, 17 Oct 1998, Jonathan David Amery wrote:
> Would it be possible to have non-tables versions of acka web pages, such
>as the thrallmaster and dungeon master's pages?
>
> My browser doesn't do tables readably,  It's quite good at frames, but
>not tables... :-(

That's very odd. what browser are you using? (I've nver found a browser
that handles frames but not tables)

- --JT

[-------------------------------------------------------------------------]
[ Practice random kindness and senseless acts of beauty.                  ]
[ It's hard to seize the day when you must first grapple with the morning ]
[-------------------------------------------------------------------------]

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 01:35:36 -0400 (EDT)
From: Gabe Drummond-Cole <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: acting officers

>
>I accept this commission.
>
>The player K 2
>requested this poem.
>It is now complete.
>
>>wishing e was prez so e could *make* JT do that :)
>
>--JT, taking a cheap way out, since the type of poem wasn't specified, and
>once more doing more than he seems :)
>

JT, oh worst of poets, you shall pay
You think your callous apathy and greed
will win you treasures, oh but not today
You did it wrong, oh yes you did indeed.

You've ruled the Ackan world for o'er a month
And now as Acting Poet you've been bad.
YOU VOTING-GNOME! YOU MU-COW! OH YOU PENGUIN!
K 2 wanted a poem, but e was had!

That's not a poem!  Poems are for real!
They read within your mind in gold and silver!
You're just the worst; your poems make me squeal!
You're poem's not metallic; it is orange!

The field of honour calls you! Come, you fool!
As K 2's second, I call you to a duel!

- --A Mean Hat.
  Daring Adventurer -- Dungeon Master - Warrior Caste - Crazy French
Scotsman - Really Weird

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 02:03:28 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: acting officers

A Mean Hat wrote:
> JT, oh worst of poets, you shall pay
> You think your callous apathy and greed
> will win you treasures, oh but not today
> You did it wrong, oh yes you did indeed.
> 
> You've ruled the Ackan world for o'er a month
> And now as Acting Poet you've been bad.
> YOU VOTING-GNOME! YOU MU-COW! OH YOU PENGUIN!
> K 2 wanted a poem, but e was had!
> 
> That's not a poem!  Poems are for real!
> They read within your mind in gold and silver!
> You're just the worst; your poems make me squeal!
> You're poem's not metallic; it is orange!
> 
> The field of honour calls you! Come, you fool!
> As K 2's second, I call you to a duel!

As second to JT I do declare:
This duel is called with total lack of flair!
K 2 challenges JT to a duel
But for a second chooses such a fool.
A Mean Hat rants on JT's treasure skill
And offices assumed beyond his will.
For most of those he had not volunteered,
But got them because breadbox disappeared.
One syllable was JT's haiku short,
A measure of very little import.
Especially for Acting Poetry
From one who took the office suddenly.
This duel JT accepts without a boast.
The contest chosen is a game of Ghost.

/dev/joe

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 02:13:49 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: acting officers

I wrote:
> A Mean Hat wrote:
> > JT, oh worst of poets, you shall pay
[...]
> > The field of honour calls you! Come, you fool!
> > As K 2's second, I call you to a duel!
> 
> As second to JT I do declare:
[...]
> This duel JT accepts without a boast.
> The contest chosen is a game of Ghost.

I volunteer to referee this duel.
I have chosen randomly JT to play the first letter.
Let the game begin.

/dev/joe

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 02:32:01 -0400 (EDT)
From: JT <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: acting officers

On Sun, 18 Oct 1998, Gabe Drummond-Cole wrote:
>>The player K 2
>>requested this poem.
>>It is now complete.

It came to my attention that someone feels this poem was missing a
syllable.   Reading over the above, I see how that might seem to be
the case.  However, one fails to notice the invisible word.

I will enclose it in asteriks below so that the I****inati don't
notice it and remove it again.

The poem really read as follows (removing the asteriks)

The player K 2
*f*n*o*r*d requested this poem.
It is now complete.

Surely as one can see, this certainly is a valid haiku.

- --JT

[-------------------------------------------------------------------------]
[ Practice random kindness and senseless acts of beauty.                  ]
[ It's hard to seize the day when you must first grapple with the morning ]
[-------------------------------------------------------------------------]

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 03:58:21 -0400 (EDT)
From: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: Acka: Raft (Calvin N Hobbes)

In a message dated 17/10/98 21:30:23 GMT, you write:

> 
>  Ahoy there! I've got the oars! All we need now are two intrepid idiots who
>  don't believe any of that probability nonsense! Why do I keep ending
>  sentences in exclamation marks! Help me I can't stop!
>  
>  risE!
I will come and dare the river

Robin Hood

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 04:45:52 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jonathan David Amery <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Web Pages.

On Sun, 18 Oct 1998, JT wrote:

> On Sat, 17 Oct 1998, Jonathan David Amery wrote:
> > Would it be possible to have non-tables versions of acka web pages, such
> >as the thrallmaster and dungeon master's pages?
> >
> > My browser doesn't do tables readably,  It's quite good at frames, but
> >not tables... :-(
> 
> That's very odd. what browser are you using? (I've nver found a browser
> that handles frames but not tables)
> 

 Well, it's ArcWeb 1.91 for RiscOs.  But the same applies somewhat to lynx
as Slakko just pointed out to me.

- -- 
Jonathan David Amery, Trinity Hall, CAMBRIDGE, CB2 1TJ.             #####
http://www.trinhall.cam.ac.uk/~jda23/home.html                  o__#######
Wild Card of Acka, member of SPAM, wearing a Silly Agenda Hat.   \'#######
Follower of Banna, the EBS and Odo.  Holding the Silver Key to the Vault.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 05:33:00 -0400 (EDT)
From: Uri Bruck <[email-masked]>
Subject: acka: Vacation

I am going on Vacation starting now - expected date of return Nov. 4th.

Niccolo Flychuck

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 11:07:20 -0400 (EDT)
From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: CFJ 659 (1-FALSE) (Amicus Draconis *)

With JT having declined judgement as per Rule 417, saaremaa has been
selected to join Vynd.

Call for Judgement 659 - September 10, 1998
Subject: Literature Translation
Initiator: Mr. Tambourine Man (sent Sep 10 1998, 18:35 Acka)
Judge: JT (selected Sep 11 1998, 11:30 Acka)
Judgement: FALSE (promulgated Sep 12 1998, 04:02 Acka)
Appellant: saaremaa (at Sep 12 1998, 11:45 Acka)
1st Cortex: Cortez's Courtly Cortege (Alfvaen and Calvin N Hobbes)
 (assigned Sep 12 1998, 11:53 Acka) (too slow)
2nd Cortex: Amicus Draconis (*saaremaa and Vynd) 
Judgement:

Statement:
An accepted proposal containing a translation of part of a work of Homer
which was of sufficient length and cited as being by Homer could cause
it's proposer to score points due to the rule "Literature" if it were
accepted.

Initiator's Reasoning:
I think this should be judged FALSE.Whilst a translation of a foreign
artist bears many things in comon with the works of the foreign artist,
that artist was not actually the author and hence the literature rule
should not apply..

Judge's Reasoning:
Reasoning:
Rule 210 is quite clear that literature must:

>A) The proposal must contain in its body [as opposed to title] one or
>   more quotations from sources listed on the Literature list. This
>   quotation must be an exact copy of words found in, written, uttered or
>   otherwise communicated by the source, enclosed in quotation
>   marks. It must contain one of the following:

In order for a quote of literature by Homer to be valid, it must be an
*exact copy* of words written, uttered or otherwise communicated by the
source.

Quoting from a translation of that source, however accurate the
translation is, is not an exact copy of words written, uttered or
otherwise communicated by the source, but rather of words written, uttered
or otherwise communicated by the translator.  Unless that translator were
also on the Literature list, or unless the specific translation were on
the Literature list, then that quote would not be literature.

Appealer's Comments:

The key sentence for one line of reasoning, the line of reasoning the
Judge apparently took, is:

> This quotation must be an exact copy of words found in, written,
> uttered or otherwise communicated by the source,

What is the correct rendering of "source"?  It is well known that in the
modern process of publishing literature, the author's manuscript is
edited by a staff editor before going into print.  In some cases the
author has final say, but in some cases the editorial staff has final say,
and for a given work or artist, it will not be generally well known who
had final say.  This also applies to recorded music where producers add
vocals to the final mix, etc.  What is the "source" in this case.  The
original author's manuscript, or the staff editor's "translation" of that?
Where is the line drawn between translation and editorial rework?  What
basis does the rule give us to draw the line anywhere?

Moreover, different printings or editions of the same work will have
different texts.  Examples include *The Stand* by Stephen King and The
Bible, Old and New Testaments.  What is the "source" in these examples?
If *any* is the answer, than *any* publication of a Homeric quote should
qualify.  It is also known, at least in the case of Plato, that scribes
at the time changed his work during transcription, even though the
language
did not change.  Could this have happened with Homer?  Who knows?  How
do we find the "source"?

We could just say that the quote must be in the original language, and
forget all these other details, but I do not see where the rules *force*
us to do this, but at the same time *allow* us to ignore the other similar
problems.

I feel that the Judge took an extremely narrow rendering of the word
"source", where a broader, more reasonable rendering is both preferable,
customary, and supported by the rule.  Which leads to the second line of
reasoning:

> All such proofs are adjudicated by the scorekeeper, unless the scorekeeper
> submitted the proposal, in which case it should be adjudicated by the
> President.

The rule provides a mechanism for judgement.  Therefore, until the
scorekeeper rules on the matter, we cannot decide this CFJ.  The rule
empowers, indeed mandates, that the scorekeeper determine whether or not
an alleged Homeric quote is indeed Literature.  Since the word "source"
is open to the problems outlined above and in other public posts, there
is no judgement-free method of determining whether an alleged quote
qualifies as Literature without the scorekeeper's opinion, which I don't
believe we have in this case, therefore a verdict of INVALID or UNDECIDED
is indicated for this CFJ.  (Even if there was a judgement-free method,
it would still be adjudicated by the scorekeeper, for as far as I can see,
could rule by whim if e wanted to).

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 11:11:35 -0400 (EDT)
From: Randy Hall <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: CFJ 659 (1-FALSE) (Amicus Draconis *)

> With JT having declined judgement as per Rule 417, saaremaa has been
> selected to join Vynd.

Except when I appealed it I declined to hear the appeal.  In any case,
I decline to hear this appeal too.

saaremaa
Justice

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 11:12:21 -0400 (EDT)
From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: CFJ 675 (Leather Artifact)

Leather Artifact has been selected.

Call for Judgement 675 - October 16, 1998
Subject: Treasure Mutability PWCFJ
Initiator: JT (sent 16 Oct 1998, 03:55 Acka)
Judge: Leather Artifact
Judgement:

Statement:

It is both legal and illegal for a player to find a treasure which has the
following map "If it is legal to find this treasure, then the last
sentance of the map shall change to read 'it is illegal to find this
treasure', else the last sentance of the map shall change to read 'it is
legal to find this treasure'.  It is legal to find this treasure"

Reasoning:

This is a paradox win CFJ.

Treasure Maps are not defined as entities, and game custom has in the past
(under the auspices of rule 101) allowed changing the map if the map
specified the conditions under which it was changed.

Under map above, it is legal to find the treasure only if it is illegal to
find the treasure only if it is legal to find the treasure.   This is a
paradox as the game action of finding the treasure is legal only in the
case where it is illegal (according to the map) and illegal only in the
case where it is legal (again according to the map).

Certainly the finding of the treasure is an action which affects the game
state and thus is valid for a paradox win CFJ.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 11:13:31 -0400 (EDT)
From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: CFJ 667 (risE) (fwd)

risE has judged this TRUE.

Call for Judgement 667 - September 24, 1998
Subject: Another weird rule-harfing question
Initiator: breadbox (sent 24 Sep 1998, 03:52 Acka)
1st Judge: Robin Hood (chosen 24 Sep 1998, 03:56 Acka) (deadbeat)
2nd Judge: risE (chosen 16 Oct 1998, 12:33 Acka)
Judgement: TRUE

Statement:

Proposal 3601 amended Rule 594.4 ("Blueprint: Vending Machine").

Reasoning:

The amendment in question from Proposal 3601 stated:

3. Amend Rule 594.4, "Blueprint: Vending Machine" by inserting after
the second paragraph the paragraph from Rule 594.11, "Blueprint: Bonus
Vote Add-On" which begins "While an unbroken Bonus Vote Add-On is
strapped" and delete that paragraph from Rule 594.11.

However, at this point in time, there was no Rule 594.11, nor was
there any other rule with the title "Blueprint: Bonus Vote Add-On" -
because Proposal 3601 had repealed such a rule several infinitesimal
moments beforehand.

Now, had the text instead been: "... the paragraph from what had been
Rule 594.11 immediately before the adoption of this proposal ...",
this would have worked.

Alternately, had Proposal 3601 created a new Rule 594.11 inbetween the
repeal of the original and the above quoted text, then that new rule
would have unambiguously been the source.

I think that this CFJ should be False, but I would like to get a
second opinion, so to speak.

Reasoning:

I think that the text referred to in proposal 3601 is unambiguous (there
is
no other text which this could reasonably refer to) and under that
consideration alone, rule 594.4 should have been amended. Even though this
rule has been repealed, it still exists as a piece of text, even if it is
outside the domain of the game. (e.g. A proposal to append the first
paragraph of Henry David Thoreau's "Walden" to an existing rule would be
valid even though "Walden" does not in any meaningful way "exist" as a
piece
of text within the game. [Ok, maybe as literature, but it's just an
example.])

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 11:15:51 -0400 (EDT)
From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: CFJ 659 (1-FALSE) (Amicus Draconis *)

On Sun, 18 Oct 1998, Randy Hall wrote:

> > With JT having declined judgement as per Rule 417, saaremaa has been
> > selected to join Vynd.
> 
> Except when I appealed it I declined to hear the appeal.  In any case,
> I decline to hear this appeal too.

The second of your sentences is, I believe, necessary.  416 Section IV
makes no mention of previous Justices declining to hear appeals when it
goes through the process of selecting a Justice to fill in for one that
goes on vacation.  417 indicates that Justices declining to hear the
appeal are treated as if they had gone on vacation.  So I could easily end
up selecting JT again in this case.

- -- 
Duncan C. Richer aka Slakko the Lost Warner Brother | Queens' College
http://www.dpmms.cam.ac.uk/~dcr24/    Ackanomic     | U. of Cambridge
Web-Harfer, CotC, ChessUmpire, Map-Harfer, Senator  | 2nd Year PhD(PMa)

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 11:17:16 -0400 (EDT)
From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: CFJ 659 (1-FALSE) (Amicus Draconis *)

With saaremaa having declined judgement as per Rule 417, Alfvaen has been
selected to replace saaremaa who was selected to replace JT who normally
judges in conjunction with Vynd.

Call for Judgement 659 - September 10, 1998
Subject: Literature Translation
Initiator: Mr. Tambourine Man (sent Sep 10 1998, 18:35 Acka)
Judge: JT (selected Sep 11 1998, 11:30 Acka)
Judgement: FALSE (promulgated Sep 12 1998, 04:02 Acka)
Appellant: saaremaa (at Sep 12 1998, 11:45 Acka)
1st Cortex: Cortez's Courtly Cortege (Alfvaen and Calvin N Hobbes)
 (assigned Sep 12 1998, 11:53 Acka) (too slow)
2nd Cortex: Amicus Draconis (*saaremaa and Vynd) 
Judgement:

Statement:
An accepted proposal containing a translation of part of a work of Homer
which was of sufficient length and cited as being by Homer could cause
it's proposer to score points due to the rule "Literature" if it were
accepted.

Initiator's Reasoning:
I think this should be judged FALSE.Whilst a translation of a foreign
artist bears many things in comon with the works of the foreign artist,
that artist was not actually the author and hence the literature rule
should not apply..

Judge's Reasoning:
Reasoning:
Rule 210 is quite clear that literature must:

>A) The proposal must contain in its body [as opposed to title] one or
>   more quotations from sources listed on the Literature list. This
>   quotation must be an exact copy of words found in, written, uttered or
>   otherwise communicated by the source, enclosed in quotation
>   marks. It must contain one of the following:

In order for a quote of literature by Homer to be valid, it must be an
*exact copy* of words written, uttered or otherwise communicated by the
source.

Quoting from a translation of that source, however accurate the
translation is, is not an exact copy of words written, uttered or
otherwise communicated by the source, but rather of words written, uttered
or otherwise communicated by the translator.  Unless that translator were
also on the Literature list, or unless the specific translation were on
the Literature list, then that quote would not be literature.

Appealer's Comments:

The key sentence for one line of reasoning, the line of reasoning the
Judge apparently took, is:

> This quotation must be an exact copy of words found in, written,
> uttered or otherwise communicated by the source,

What is the correct rendering of "source"?  It is well known that in the
modern process of publishing literature, the author's manuscript is
edited by a staff editor before going into print.  In some cases the
author has final say, but in some cases the editorial staff has final say,
and for a given work or artist, it will not be generally well known who
had final say.  This also applies to recorded music where producers add
vocals to the final mix, etc.  What is the "source" in this case.  The
original author's manuscript, or the staff editor's "translation" of that?
Where is the line drawn between translation and editorial rework?  What
basis does the rule give us to draw the line anywhere?

Moreover, different printings or editions of the same work will have
different texts.  Examples include *The Stand* by Stephen King and The
Bible, Old and New Testaments.  What is the "source" in these examples?
If *any* is the answer, than *any* publication of a Homeric quote should
qualify.  It is also known, at least in the case of Plato, that scribes
at the time changed his work during transcription, even though the
language
did not change.  Could this have happened with Homer?  Who knows?  How
do we find the "source"?

We could just say that the quote must be in the original language, and
forget all these other details, but I do not see where the rules *force*
us to do this, but at the same time *allow* us to ignore the other similar
problems.

I feel that the Judge took an extremely narrow rendering of the word
"source", where a broader, more reasonable rendering is both preferable,
customary, and supported by the rule.  Which leads to the second line of
reasoning:

> All such proofs are adjudicated by the scorekeeper, unless the scorekeeper
> submitted the proposal, in which case it should be adjudicated by the
> President.

The rule provides a mechanism for judgement.  Therefore, until the
scorekeeper rules on the matter, we cannot decide this CFJ.  The rule
empowers, indeed mandates, that the scorekeeper determine whether or not
an alleged Homeric quote is indeed Literature.  Since the word "source"
is open to the problems outlined above and in other public posts, there
is no judgement-free method of determining whether an alleged quote
qualifies as Literature without the scorekeeper's opinion, which I don't
believe we have in this case, therefore a verdict of INVALID or UNDECIDED
is indicated for this CFJ.  (Even if there was a judgement-free method,
it would still be adjudicated by the scorekeeper, for as far as I can see,
could rule by whim if e wanted to).

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 12:35:35 -0400 (EDT)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Acka: Paella

I would like the last character of the message please.

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page:http://www.connect.ab.ca/~alfvaen/)
Song In My Head--Chicago:Stay The Night
Current Book--Anne Rice:The Queen of The Damned
'I want you to accompany me on the safari.' 'I've never played one in my life!'

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 13:35:49 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jonathan David Amery <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Moving.

 I leave the library and return home.

- -- 
Jonathan David Amery, Trinity Hall, CAMBRIDGE, CB2 1TJ.             #####
http://www.trinhall.cam.ac.uk/~jda23/home.html                  o__#######
Wild Card of Acka, member of SPAM, wearing a Silly Agenda Hat.   \'#######
Follower of Banna, the EBS and Odo.  Holding the Silver Key to the Vault.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 13:54:49 -0400 (EDT)
From: JT <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Web Pages.

On Sun, 18 Oct 1998, Jonathan David Amery wrote:
>> > Would it be possible to have non-tables versions of acka web pages, such
>> >as the thrallmaster and dungeon master's pages?
>> >
>> > My browser doesn't do tables readably,  It's quite good at frames, but
>> >not tables... :-(
>> 
>> That's very odd. what browser are you using? (I've nver found a browser
>> that handles frames but not tables)
>
> Well, it's ArcWeb 1.91 for RiscOs.  But the same applies somewhat to lynx
>as Slakko just pointed out to me.

Well I'd claim that lynx doesn't do framesets very well either :)  but
your point is taken.   Question for you though, does ArcWeb have any
problems with my trinkets pages?  I use tables, but they display
reasonably under lynx as well as netscape and IE.

- --JT

[-------------------------------------------------------------------------]
[ Practice random kindness and senseless acts of beauty.                  ]
[ It's hard to seize the day when you must first grapple with the morning ]
[-------------------------------------------------------------------------]

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 13:59:28 -0400 (EDT)
From: JT <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: CFJ 675 (Leather Artifact)

On Sun, 18 Oct 1998, Duncan Richer wrote:
>Leather Artifact has been selected.
>
>Call for Judgement 675 - October 16, 1998
>Subject: Treasure Mutability PWCFJ
>Initiator: JT (sent 16 Oct 1998, 03:55 Acka)
>Judge: Leather Artifact
>Judgement:

I retract this CFJ.

- --JT

[-------------------------------------------------------------------------]
[ Practice random kindness and senseless acts of beauty.                  ]
[ It's hard to seize the day when you must first grapple with the morning ]
[-------------------------------------------------------------------------]

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 18:43:46 -0400 (EDT)
From: JT <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Web pages back

With thanks to IdiotBoy who is allowing me to use space on brain.mics.net
for my ackanomic web pages, they are now available again at

http://brain.mics.net/~jt/acka/

intead of

http://www.nausicaa.net/~jtraub/acka/

Please update any links from the nausicaa.net website to the
brain.mics.net website.

- --JT

[-------------------------------------------------------------------------]
[ Practice random kindness and senseless acts of beauty.                  ]
[ It's hard to seize the day when you must first grapple with the morning ]
[-------------------------------------------------------------------------]

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 18:59:52 -0400 (EDT)
From: Alexandre Muniz <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka Paella

Tom Walmsley wrote:
> 
> JT wrote:
> 
> > On Sun, 18 Oct 1998, Alexandre Muniz wrote:
> > >reveal character number 39
> > >two-star
> >
> > And I would like the 17th :)
> 

If an entity called frankfurter exists I eat it on the steps of the Town
Hall. Otherwise I eat a non entity called frankfurter on the steps of
the Town Hall.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 19:29:28 -0400 (EDT)
From: Matt Miller <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka Paella

On Sun, 18 Oct 1998, Alexandre Muniz wrote:

> If an entity called frankfurter exists I eat it on the steps of the Town
> Hall. Otherwise I eat a non entity called frankfurter on the steps of
> the Town Hall.
> 

Congratulations to two-star winner of the first ever game of Paella...

He also finds my most recenlt burried treasure.

The actual map for the treasure was:

The Treasure will be found by the winner of the first game of Paella.

IB

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 20:55:34 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jonathan David Amery <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Web Pages.

On Sun, 18 Oct 1998, JT wrote:

> On Sun, 18 Oct 1998, Jonathan David Amery wrote:
> >> > Would it be possible to have non-tables versions of acka web pages, such
> >> >as the thrallmaster and dungeon master's pages?
> >> >
> >> > My browser doesn't do tables readably,  It's quite good at frames, but
> >> >not tables... :-(
> >> 
> >> That's very odd. what browser are you using? (I've nver found a browser
> >> that handles frames but not tables)
> >
> > Well, it's ArcWeb 1.91 for RiscOs.  But the same applies somewhat to lynx
> >as Slakko just pointed out to me.
> 
> Well I'd claim that lynx doesn't do framesets very well either :)  but
> your point is taken.   Question for you though, does ArcWeb have any
> problems with my trinkets pages?  I use tables, but they display
> reasonably under lynx as well as netscape and IE.

 It seems to work - it's Slakko's that are the worse, since they have each
entry on a seperate line...

- -- 
Jonathan David Amery, Trinity Hall, CAMBRIDGE, CB2 1TJ.             #####
http://www.trinhall.cam.ac.uk/~jda23/home.html                  o__#######
Wild Card of Acka, member of SPAM, wearing a Silly Agenda Hat.   \'#######
Follower of Banna, the EBS and Odo.  Holding the Silver Key to the Vault.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 21:36:59 -0400 (EDT)
From: JT <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Web Pages.

On Sun, 18 Oct 1998, Jonathan David Amery wrote:
>On Sun, 18 Oct 1998, JT wrote:
>> Well I'd claim that lynx doesn't do framesets very well either :)  but
>> your point is taken.   Question for you though, does ArcWeb have any
>> problems with my trinkets pages?  I use tables, but they display
>> reasonably under lynx as well as netscape and IE.
>
> It seems to work - it's Slakko's that are the worse, since they have each
>entry on a seperate line...

Interestingly enough, Lynx has the same problem with slakko's site on some
of the tables.  I haven't looked at the HTML, but I'd be willing to bet
there was a small but signifigant error for those pages that IE/Netscape
handles correctly but Lynx handles differently.

Slakko, a good example of a page which acts this way under lynx is
http://www.dpmms.cam.ac.uk/~dcr24/Nomic/Acka/players/archive.html

Hope this helps in tracking down whatever the problem is :)

- --JT

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End of ackanomic digest V3 #364
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