Subject: ackanomic digest V3 #264
From: [email-masked] (ackanomic digest)
To: [email-masked]

ackanomic digest        Friday, August 7 1998        Volume 03 : Number 264

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 01:36:38 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Freddy!

Alfvaen played Freddy in Noises Off!

/dev/joe

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 02:39:28 -0400 (EDT)
From: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [Fwd: Acka: CFJ637]

In a message dated 06/08/98  22:43:45, you write:

> negative numbers are generally defined as prime if and only
>  > if their absolute value is zero.
>  
>  Let me get this straight. Negative numbers are prime if they aren't
>  negative?

I meant the absolute valute should be prime. I just forgot
to read what I wrote.

Robinh Hood

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 07:12:18 -0400 (EDT)
From: Uri Bruck <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: acka : Yet Another New Order

On Thu, 6 Aug 1998, Brian Raiter wrote:

> > Another, unrelated idea, but that could be easily combined with any
> > system, is to open up some roles for free enterprise. Let us take the
> > Promoter's job. Why have only one Promoter.
> 
> Think about consistent (as in non-duplicated) Proposal numbers. 
This can dealt with using prefix characters, as I believe this RFC does,
for each Promoter.
> Think
> about having one Tabulator, who knows precisely, at any given time,
> what Proposals are up for voting and which aren't. 
I was thinking of combining both - the RFC that was posted suggesting
keeping the tabulation central which may handle this.

>                Think about an
> accurate and well-maintained Proposal archive.

This is a good point!

Niccolo Flychuck

> 
> breadbox
> 
> ------------------------------
> 

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 08:09:37 -0400 (EDT)
From: Towsner <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: acka : Yet Another New Order

>>                Think about an
>> accurate and well-maintained Proposal archive.
	I envision (my apologies to breadbox) having the Tabulator maintain
the archive.  This makes more sense anyway since the Tabulator is the one
who deals with proposals last.

- --
- -Henry Towsner

	<[email-masked]>

	Thank heavens, the sun has gone in, and I don't have to go out and
enjoy it.
		-Logan Pearsall Smith

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 09:53:30 -0400 (EDT)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Acka: More Name Confusion

I just noticed, while checking the Treasure page, that Treasure 221,
buried on July 15th, contains my Really Big Blue Thing That Doesn't Do
Too Much, Really.  So was it possible for me to use it to change player
names?  Probably not, eh?

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/ )
Song In My Head--Moxy Fruvous:The Ballad of Cedric Fruvous
Current Book--Sheri S. Tepper:Shadow's End
The question is...is there a house around the doctor?

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 09:56:17 -0400 (EDT)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Re: Acka: Freddy!

> Alfvaen played Freddy in Noises Off!

/dev/joe has found Treasure 155, whose map was the following:

The treasure shall be found by the first player, besides Alfvaen, who
posts to the public forum that Alfvaen played the part of "Freddy",
"Frederick", or "Philip" in "Noises Off".

This one was a toughie, but obviously the recent clues helped...:-)

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/ )
Song In My Head--Moxy Fruvous:The Ballad of Cedric Fruvous
Current Book--Sheri S. Tepper:Shadow's End
Air is water with holes in it.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 10:18:26 -0400 (EDT)
From: [email-masked] (Micah Smukler)
Subject: Re: Acka: AVPP

>On Thu, 6 Aug 1998, K2 wrote:
>
>> I denounce this suggestion.
>> I suggest the following be apppended to the party manifesto (or
>>whatever):(---
>> delimited)
>> ---
>> Moreover, should the concept of anti-voting ever be removed from this
>>fair game
>> of Ackanomic, the members of AVPP shall be constrained to vote on each
>>and every
>> proposal, especially those submitted by opponents of anti-voting, as if
>>they (the
>> members of AVPP) (well, the opponents can too, I suppose) were able to gain
>> points for anti-voting.
>> ---
>
>I approve this suggestion.
>

I also approve this suggestion.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 10:29:52 -0400 (EDT)
From: Tom Walmsley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Primes

>r * ( summation starting with j=1 and moving up to r-1 of [ lim as y ->
>infinity of { cos ^ ( 2 * y ) of [ { r * pi } / j ] } ] = r

The problem here is that you've got most of it in square brackets which
would therefore have no semantic meaning.

MTM.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 10:29:55 -0400 (EDT)
From: Tom Walmsley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: P3385

At 02:44 07/08/98 -0400, you wrote:
>Proposal 3385
>Just Like It Too
>K 2 (Kelly Kelly)

I like the basic concept here but...

>Amend Rule 506.1 (Magik) to read in full:
>This is a Modest Proposal.

Won't this mss things up quit nastily?

>{{[For consistency]}}
>Rename Rule 506.1 (Magik) to "Majik".

And I object to this. I like this pointless little idiosyncracy.

MTM.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 10:29:57 -0400 (EDT)
From: Tom Walmsley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka:  OC trade

>Oh, while I'm here, I offer MTM A$7 for an Otzma Card Lay Off! since our
>draconian Financier nullified my previous one.  For the same reason, I
>sent this to ackanomic instead of acka-finance.

If I have to then I accept this offer.

MTM.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 10:29:58 -0400 (EDT)
From: Tom Walmsley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Game state tracking

>I have Goldenmean ffinding the raft on 2/08/1998  8:37:51 - so MTM must've
dun
>it....

I do remember doing this if it's any help to anyone.

MTM.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 10:30:00 -0400 (EDT)
From: Tom Walmsley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Multi proposals comments

At 21:47 06/08/98 -0400, you wrote:
>Here's yet another draft -- this one is designed to allow the submission
>of up to five independent proposals, with the players able to chose
>which one shall be accepted.  It uses what is called "approval voting",
>in which you can vote in favor of as few or as many of the independent
>proposals as you like, but only the one with the most votes will win:

An interesting idea. WhatI think I would prefer to see would be if people
vote ofr whether the multi-proposal passes or fails seperately to any of
the individual proposals. Then if it passed the proposal in the
multi-proposalwith the most yes votes passes even if it wouldn't otherwise
and if it fails then none of them pass regardless of the number of votes.

This would be useful for situations where people agreed that a change was
necessary but couldn't agree on what the change should be.

MTM.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 10:30:05 -0400 (EDT)
From: Tom Walmsley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Treasure

>>Ruby?
>
>How about sapphire?

Neither of these are correct, nor are any of the manyother guesses so far.
I remind you also that you need to explain why so even if you get the right
colour (which one of you may or may not have done :-)) you won't find the
treasure if you have supplied none/the wrong reasoning.

MTM.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 10:34:52 -0400 (EDT)
From: K2 <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Otzma cards of type Go Fish (fwd)

JT wrote:

>I see no reason to believe that K 2 was wrong. Therefore this is merely an

> error in the rules easily fixed by a CSR since the number should have been
> 14 and not the 13 that is reported in the rule.

The Official Rules Document is not the Rules. Modification of the Official Rules
Document does not affect the rules.

A CSR isn't nessacary, the rules are correct, the rules document is not...

K 2

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 10:35:21 -0400 (EDT)
From: K2 <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: AVPP

I suggest that the AVPP change its membership policy to Quasi-open.

K 2

[email-masked] wrote:

> I hereby join the anti-voting preservative party.
> (Its open, so I don't have to ask anyone, right)
>
> We should restore the spirit of antivoting if in
> quite the same form.
>
> Robin Hood

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 10:46:39 -0400 (EDT)
From: K2 <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Proposal 3385

nomicbot wrote:

> Proposal 3385
> Just Like It Too
> K 2 (Kelly Kelly)
>
> Amend Rule 506.1 (Magik) to read in full:
> This is a Modest Proposal.

Serves me right for typing this in last :)

I retract P3385.

K 2

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 10:54:27 -0400 (EDT)
From: JT <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: More Name Confusion

On Fri, 7 Aug 1998, Aaron V. Humphrey wrote:
>I just noticed, while checking the Treasure page, that Treasure 221,
>buried on July 15th, contains my Really Big Blue Thing That Doesn't Do
>Too Much, Really.  So was it possible for me to use it to change player
>names?  Probably not, eh?

I admit that I forgot to check this.  However, the passage of a prop
undead the use of it that you used, so all things came out nicely
regardless :)  I will be more diligent verifying the ownership of Blue
things in the future.

- --JT

[-------------------------------------------------------------------------]
[ Practice random kindness and senseless acts of beauty.                  ]
[ It's hard to seize the day when you must first grapple with the morning ]
[-------------------------------------------------------------------------]

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 11:04:50 -0400 (EDT)
From: K2 <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: More Name Confusion

I create a trinket called "I will remember not to stick my finger in a
light socket" with the description :
"Because it hurts! - Almost as much as setting you're self on fire." valued
at A$ 5.

I gift this trinket to The Twits.

Aaron V. Humphrey wrote:

> I just noticed, while checking the Treasure page, that Treasure 221,
> buried on July 15th, contains my Really Big Blue Thing That Doesn't Do
> Too Much, Really.  So was it possible for me to use it to change player
> names?  Probably not, eh?
>
> --
> --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/ )
> Song In My Head--Moxy Fruvous:The Ballad of Cedric Fruvous
> Current Book--Sheri S. Tepper:Shadow's End
> The question is...is there a house around the doctor?

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 11:32:44 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Michael Pizolato" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: RFC - Weekends Off

Request for Comment:

Create a new rule, numbered appropriately, with the title "Weekends Off" and
the following WEEKEND-delimited text:

WEEKEND
No rule which specifies that an action must occur within some period of time
shall specify a period of less than three (3) days for that period.

{{[This was prompted by Publius' RFC specifying that reconsiderations must
be submitted within 24 hours. My Acka mail comes to me at work, so I almost
never see mail received over the weekend until the Monday following. This
doesn't account for long weekends or vacations, but vacations at least are
dealt with elsewhere. As for long weekends, this is an international group
and holidays vary from country to country; unless official Acka-holidays are
designated there's no good way to deal with them (not that designating
official Acka-holidays for other purposes is a bad idea :-).]}}
WEEKEND

Amend all rules which specify that an action must occur within three (3) or
fewer days so they refer to a period two (2) days longer.

{{[For example, the final sentence of Rule 205, paragraph (1), subparagraph
(c) changes from "They must do so within 3 days" to "They must do so within
5 days."]}}

Thanks,
Piz

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 12:11:18 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Freddy!

> > Alfvaen played Freddy in Noises Off!
> 
> /dev/joe has found Treasure 155, whose map was the following:
> 
> The treasure shall be found by the first player, besides Alfvaen, who
> posts to the public forum that Alfvaen played the part of "Freddy",
> "Frederick", or "Philip" in "Noises Off".
> 
> This one was a toughie, but obviously the recent clues helped...:-)

Just as Alfvaen said, the prayers for deliverance he posted shortly after
burying that treasure had messages encoded as vigenere ciphers (I'll let
alfvaen explain what these are to any of the newbies who joined since he
posted a full explanation with his other treasure not long ago) with the
key "azpiazu".  The one in July said something like "first four and last
eight".  The first four letters in the solution to the word division
problems were "VGNR" - an abbreviated form of "vigenere".  The last eight
were suspiciously in alphabetical order, and as Alfvaen hinted, they were
the key for the cipher, encoded in the other 48 characters of the solution,
which said something like "post a public message telling who alfvaen played
in noises off.  Sure enough, around this time he posted a message telling
that he played freddy in noises off, in the solutions to his "cite my
sig quotations" treasure.  Grep is godly.

I searched his other, later prayers for deliverance for more clues, but
only found two snide remarks about the Vulcan takeover. (or was it Pulcan?)
When he buried the next treasure, he said he just got a new idea for a
treasure, so I didn't look in his earlier prayers, though they might
provide interesting reading. :-)

/dev/joe

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 12:27:26 -0400 (EDT)
From: Tom Walmsley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: BWG

>> If I happen to be a member of any political party then I suggest that it
>> disbands and then leave it.
>
>On research?

If I happen to be a member of any political party then I suggest that it
disbands and then leave it.

MTM.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 12:27:42 -0400 (EDT)
From: Tom Walmsley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Vending Machine

At 10:35 07/08/98 -0400, you wrote:
>I wonder if I may point out to our inventor that e has been negligent in
>the matter of my vending machine, could it be that e is holding out
>until bonus vote add-ons are repealed ?
>
>K 2
>
>K2 wrote:
>
>> I bid A$50.

Oops. I'd forgotten about that. I believe that this was the winning bid for
the vending machine.

MTM.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 12:47:52 -0400 (EDT)
From: [email-masked] (Micah Smukler)
Subject: Acka: More Literature?

Just because I feel like it, I am issuing the following CSR, numbered
145, which consists solely of proposed modifications to the Literature
List:

Add the following STUFF-delimited entries to the Literature List:

STUFF

Artist: Aeschylus
Artist: Jerome K. Jerome; author of Three Men in a Boat
Artist: Tom Lehrer; satirist
Artist: Douglas Hofstadter
Artist: Peter Suber; the Nomic guy
Artist: Edgar Allen Poe
Artist: Robert A. Heinlein
Artist: Herman Melville
Artist: Julius Caesar
Work: The Declaration of Independence of the United States of America
Work: The Oxford English Dictionary
Work: On Formally Undecidable Propositions in _Principia Mathematica
and related systems; Goedel's Incompleteness Theorem
STUFF

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 13:07:08 -0400 (EDT)
From: John Frederic Mc Coy <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: More Literature?

On Fri, 7 Aug 1998, Micah Smukler wrote:

> Just because I feel like it, I am issuing the following CSR, numbered
> 145, which consists solely of proposed modifications to the Literature
> List:
> 
> Add the following STUFF-delimited entries to the Literature List:
> 
> STUFF
> 
> Artist: Aeschylus
> Artist: Jerome K. Jerome; author of Three Men in a Boat
> Artist: Tom Lehrer; satirist
> Artist: Douglas Hofstadter
> Artist: Peter Suber; the Nomic guy
> Artist: Edgar Allen Poe
> Artist: Robert A. Heinlein
> Artist: Herman Melville
> Artist: Julius Caesar
> Work: The Declaration of Independence of the United States of America
> Work: The Oxford English Dictionary
> Work: On Formally Undecidable Propositions in _Principia Mathematica
> and related systems; Goedel's Incompleteness Theorem
> STUFF
> 
> 

I object to this CSR.  I don't think its a good idea to have a Dictionary
as Literature.

Vynd

[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 13:11:47 -0400 (EDT)
From: Matt Miller <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: More Literature?

On Fri, 7 Aug 1998, John Frederic Mc Coy wrote:

> 
> 
> On Fri, 7 Aug 1998, Micah Smukler wrote:
> 
> > Just because I feel like it, I am issuing the following CSR, numbered
> > 145, which consists solely of proposed modifications to the Literature
> > List:
> > 
> > Add the following STUFF-delimited entries to the Literature List:
> > 
> > STUFF
> > 
> > Artist: Aeschylus
> > Artist: Jerome K. Jerome; author of Three Men in a Boat
> > Artist: Tom Lehrer; satirist
> > Artist: Douglas Hofstadter
> > Artist: Peter Suber; the Nomic guy
> > Artist: Edgar Allen Poe
> > Artist: Robert A. Heinlein
> > Artist: Herman Melville
> > Artist: Julius Caesar
> > Work: The Declaration of Independence of the United States of America
> > Work: The Oxford English Dictionary
> > Work: On Formally Undecidable Propositions in _Principia Mathematica
> > and related systems; Goedel's Incompleteness Theorem
> > STUFF
> > 
> > 
> 
> I object to this CSR.  I don't think its a good idea to have a Dictionary
> as Literature.
> 
> Vynd
> 
> 
> [email-masked]
> 
> 
> 

<AOL>
Me, too.
</AOL>

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 13:17:14 -0400 (EDT)
From: [email-masked] (Micah Smukler)
Subject: Re: Acka: More Literature?

>On Fri, 7 Aug 1998, Micah Smukler wrote:
>
>> Just because I feel like it, I am issuing the following CSR, numbered
>> 145, which consists solely of proposed modifications to the Literature
>> List:
>>
>> Add the following STUFF-delimited entries to the Literature List:
>>
>> STUFF
>>
>> Artist: Aeschylus
>> Artist: Jerome K. Jerome; author of Three Men in a Boat
>> Artist: Tom Lehrer; satirist
>> Artist: Douglas Hofstadter
>> Artist: Peter Suber; the Nomic guy
>> Artist: Edgar Allen Poe
>> Artist: Robert A. Heinlein
>> Artist: Herman Melville
>> Artist: Julius Caesar
>> Work: The Declaration of Independence of the United States of America
>> Work: The Oxford English Dictionary
>> Work: On Formally Undecidable Propositions in _Principia Mathematica
>> and related systems; Goedel's Incompleteness Theorem
>> STUFF
>>
>>
>
>I object to this CSR.  I don't think its a good idea to have a Dictionary
>as Literature.
>
>Vynd
>
>
>[email-masked]

Just out of curiousity, why not?

And you object if the dictionary were removed?

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 13:34:02 -0400 (EDT)
From: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: Acka: AVPP

In a message dated 07/08/98  14:25:10, you write:

> >fair game
>  >> of Ackanomic, the members of AVPP shall be constrained to vote on each
>  >>and every
>  >> proposal, especially those submitted by opponents of anti-voting, as if
>  >>they (the
>  >> members of AVPP) (well, the opponents can too, I suppose) were able to 
> gain
>  >> points for anti-voting.
>  >> ---
>  >
>  >I approve this suggestion.
>  >
>  
>  I also approve this suggestion.
>  
I agree.

There should also be an addendum saying that
even if points are abolished members will still vote
as though they could gain benefits by voting against
the majority, and attempt to make the rules give all
players such benefits.

Robin Hood

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 14:19:11 -0400 (EDT)
From: Towsner <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: AVPP

>There should also be an addendum saying that
>even if points are abolished members will still vote
>as though they could gain benefits by voting against
>the majority, and attempt to make the rules give all
>players such benefits.
	And how about adding "If voting is ever abolished members should
publicly post votes on random things as if there were still benefits for
doing so."

- --
- -Henry Towsner

	<[email-masked]>

	Thank heavens, the sun has gone in, and I don't have to go out and
enjoy it.
		-Logan Pearsall Smith

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 14:19:18 -0400 (EDT)
From: Towsner <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: More Literature?

>Just because I feel like it, I am issuing the following CSR, numbered
>145, which consists solely of proposed modifications to the Literature
>List:
>
>Add the following STUFF-delimited entries to the Literature List:
>
>STUFF
>
>Artist: Aeschylus
>Artist: Jerome K. Jerome; author of Three Men in a Boat
>Artist: Tom Lehrer; satirist
>Artist: Douglas Hofstadter
>Artist: Peter Suber; the Nomic guy
>Artist: Edgar Allen Poe
>Artist: Robert A. Heinlein
>Artist: Herman Melville
>Artist: Julius Caesar
>Work: The Declaration of Independence of the United States of America
>Work: The Oxford English Dictionary
>Work: On Formally Undecidable Propositions in _Principia Mathematica
>and related systems; Goedel's Incompleteness Theorem
>STUFF

	I objec to this CFJ because I don't want anyone to have an excuse
to start quoting Goedel's Incompleteness Theorem.
	However I like the rest, including the dictionary.  Remember there
are limits on how short a quote can be.

- --
- -Henry Towsner

	<[email-masked]>

	Thank heavens, the sun has gone in, and I don't have to go out and
enjoy it.
		-Logan Pearsall Smith

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 14:30:26 -0400 (EDT)
From: Tom Walmsley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Ulp

I just realised that I can't vote at the moment because of my inability to
send messages to muppetlabs. Is there any chance of an alias for nomicbot
IdiotBoy?

Meanwhile, have you any idea why I suddenly can't get through to muppetlabs
all of a sudden breadbox?

MTM.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 14:35:25 -0400 (EDT)
From: Matt Miller <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Ulp

On Fri, 7 Aug 1998, Tom Walmsley wrote:

> I just realised that I can't vote at the moment because of my inability to
> send messages to muppetlabs. Is there any chance of an alias for nomicbot
> IdiotBoy?
> 

Done!

> Meanwhile, have you any idea why I suddenly can't get through to muppetlabs
> all of a sudden breadbox?
> 
> MTM.
> 

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 15:20:39 -0400 (EDT)
From: John Frederic Mc Coy <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: More Literature?

On Fri, 7 Aug 1998, Micah Smukler wrote:

> >On Fri, 7 Aug 1998, Micah Smukler wrote:
> >
> >> Just because I feel like it, I am issuing the following CSR, numbered
> >> 145, which consists solely of proposed modifications to the Literature
> >> List:
> >>
> >> Add the following STUFF-delimited entries to the Literature List:
> >>
> >> STUFF
> >>
> >> Artist: Aeschylus
> >> Artist: Jerome K. Jerome; author of Three Men in a Boat
> >> Artist: Tom Lehrer; satirist
> >> Artist: Douglas Hofstadter
> >> Artist: Peter Suber; the Nomic guy
> >> Artist: Edgar Allen Poe
> >> Artist: Robert A. Heinlein
> >> Artist: Herman Melville
> >> Artist: Julius Caesar
> >> Work: The Declaration of Independence of the United States of America
> >> Work: The Oxford English Dictionary
> >> Work: On Formally Undecidable Propositions in _Principia Mathematica
> >> and related systems; Goedel's Incompleteness Theorem
> >> STUFF
> >>
> >>
> >
> >I object to this CSR.  I don't think its a good idea to have a Dictionary
> >as Literature.
> >
> >Vynd
> >
> >
> >[email-masked]
> 
> Just out of curiousity, why not?
> 
> And you object if the dictionary were removed?
> 

Well, essentially because I don't think its a good example of literature.
I certainly don't want to see verbatim quotes from the Dictionary showing
up in the rules, this would seem to encourage that.

If it were removed, well, I don't want to be a meany or anything, but I've
never heard of this Jerome guy, nor Tom Lehrer.  So I'd still be halfway
inclined to object.  Frankly, I wish that we still had to do this by
proposal, so two guys like me, who has somehow missed out on the
brilliant works of <insert name here> aren't the deciding factor on this
stuff.

Oh, and I'm pretty sure that some of these people are already on the list,
especially Poe and Heinlein.

Vynd

[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 16:05:27 -0400 (EDT)
From: Brian Raiter <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: More Literature?

> Just because I feel like it, I am issuing the following CSR, numbered
> 145, which consists solely of proposed modifications to the Literature
> List:
> 
> Add the following STUFF-delimited entries to the Literature List:

Were it not a moot point now, I would also object because of this:

> Artist: Aeschylus

Aeschylus' works are in ancient Greek. Without specifying a particular
English translation (of which there are many, and which, as is usual
for such stuff, have widely varying texts), it's a tad bit ambiguous
as to what, exactly, it encompasses.

breadbox

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 16:14:52 -0400 (EDT)
From: Brian Raiter <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: acka : Yet Another New Order

>>>                Think about an
>>> accurate and well-maintained Proposal archive.
> 	I envision (my apologies to breadbox) having the Tabulator maintain
> the archive.  This makes more sense anyway since the Tabulator is the one
> who deals with proposals last.

I agree that this makes sense, but then, if there is still one
Tabulator who remains responsible for tracking all Proposals, then I
have to ask if this idea really adds much to the game, besides extra
complexity.

breadbox

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 16:21:47 -0400 (EDT)
From: Mueller <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: RFC - Weekends Off

Piz wrote:
>
>Request for Comment:
>
>Amend all rules which specify that an action must occur
>within three (3) or fewer days so they refer to a period
>two (2) days longer.
>

This might have some negative effects on party chess.  When the chess game
left the list order and went into a free for all, the times would move to 4
days and 5 days, perhaps losing some of the "frenetic action" feels.  Also
this would change the ratio of moves.  In the current version, over the
course of 6 days, 2-day-Swingers could go 3 times vs. 3-day-Swingers moving
twice.  With this proposal it would take 20 days before a similar gain was
made, and if memory serves, the free for all state only lasts 14 days.

Studge

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 17:13:49 -0400 (EDT)
From: Brian Raiter <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Ulp

> I just realised that I can't vote at the moment because of my inability to
> send messages to muppetlabs. Is there any chance of an alias for nomicbot
> IdiotBoy?

Did you try the web form? That should still be available to you.

> Meanwhile, have you any idea why I suddenly can't get through to
> muppetlabs all of a sudden breadbox?

I can't see anything particularly obvious on my end, especially since
I seem to be able to get mail to you. Can you foward any bounces/error
notifications to me? (Via a third party, I guess.)

breadbox

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 18:22:15 -0400 (EDT)
From: Brandon Ray <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Multi proposals comments

Tom Walmsley wrote:

> An interesting idea. WhatI think I would prefer to see would be if people
> vote ofr whether the multi-proposal passes or fails seperately to any of
> the individual proposals. Then if it passed the proposal in the
> multi-proposalwith the most yes votes passes even if it wouldn't otherwise
> and if it fails then none of them pass regardless of the number of votes.
>
> This would be useful for situations where people agreed that a change was
> necessary but couldn't agree on what the change should be.
>
> MTM.

Hmm.  My concern with that variation is that people might agree that a change
is needed, but the author might have concocted only one solution which they
found acceptable.  If I understand what you are suggesting, the voters would
then be asked to accept a pig in a poke -- they would be asked to commit
themselves to change in advance of knowing which of the alternatives (most of
which they didn't like) would prevail.

The way I have worded it, they can be assured of preserving the status quo,
if none of the alternatives are really acceptable to a voting majority.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 18:45:52 -0400 (EDT)
From: Brandon Ray <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: RFC - Weekends Off

Michael Pizolato wrote:

> Request for Comment:
>
> Create a new rule, numbered appropriately, with the title "Weekends Off" and
> the following WEEKEND-delimited text:
>
> WEEKEND
> No rule which specifies that an action must occur within some period of time
> shall specify a period of less than three (3) days for that period.
>
> {{[This was prompted by Publius' RFC specifying that reconsiderations must
> be submitted within 24 hours.

FWIW, I immediately amended my proposal when it was pointed out to me (a new
player) what the custom has been, and why it is like that.

I guess I'd hate to see the group bind its hands this way.  I don't perceive it
to be a real problem; a polite pointer solved it the one time it has occurred
since I've joined.  Yet, as at least one other pointed out, there might be
instances where it would be desireable to require quick action.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 18:59:34 -0400 (EDT)
From: Tom Walmsley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Multi proposals comments

>Hmm.  My concern with that variation is that people might agree that a change
>is needed, but the author might have concocted only one solution which they
>found acceptable.  If I understand what you are suggesting, the voters would
>then be asked to accept a pig in a poke -- they would be asked to commit
>themselves to change in advance of knowing which of the alternatives (most of
>which they didn't like) would prevail.
>
>The way I have worded it, they can be assured of preserving the status quo,
>if none of the alternatives are really acceptable to a voting majority.

It may be true that they don't like many or even any of the alternatives
but they may believe that the status quo is even worse. This way if enough
people want to change things then there iwll be change even if they can't
agree on what the change should be.

MTM.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 19:29:40 -0400 (EDT)
From: Tom Walmsley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: RFC: Primes Defined

>Why not just state that the burden of proof is on the person who asserts
that a
>number is prime?  Faced with that, I would choose a number off the list
someone
>posted earlier, so as to avoid the hassle of arguing over Fermat's
theorem, or
>whatnot.  Anyone who enjoys arguing about math could use whatever other
method
>they want, and if it mattered to me I'd issue a CFJ and state that it was
unproven
>that X was prime.

What if nobody actuallywanted to assert that a number was prime though? Say
we had a rule that stated:

"If ever the number of players is prime then all players will lose all
their points and AckaDollars."

Then lets say at some point there were 31 players, who's going to go and
prove that 31 is prime? Not me certainly.

MTM.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 20:20:29 -0400 (EDT)
From: Matt Miller <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Nomicbot alias.

I screwed up on the nomicbot alias earlier.  It now should work.  

[email-masked]

IB
muppetabs.com would be cool if you were selling exercise equipment.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 21:49:19 -0400 (EDT)
From: [email-masked] (John Bollinger)
Subject: Re:  Acka: Nomicbot alias.

IdiotBoy wrote:

>muppetabs.com would be cool if you were selling exercise equipment.

Would I get to choose the muppet?

"Hello?  Yes?  I'd like Sam the Eagle abs, please."

ThinMan

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 21:51:25 -0400 (EDT)
From: [email-masked] (John Bollinger)
Subject: Re:  Acka: Nomicbot alias.

ThinMan wrote:
>"Hello?  Yes?  I'd like Sam the Eagle abs, please."

Or how about "Harry Monster abs"?

ThinMan

------------------------------

End of ackanomic digest V3 #264
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