Subject: ackanomic digest V3 #160
From: [email-masked] (ackanomic digest)
To: [email-masked]

ackanomic digest         Monday, May 18 1998         Volume 03 : Number 160

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 13:04:35 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Tom Walmsley" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Name change.

> >Once and Future IdiotBoy.
> >We are all Idiots and I am your King.
> 
> I didn't know we 'ad a King.  I thought we were an autonomous collective.

Haven't you seen Star Trek First Contact? The Borg are a collective and they
had a Queen. Why can't we have a king?

TGW.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 13:04:38 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Tom Walmsley" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: CFJ 593 (J.M. Bear)

> I'm not quite clear what you are arguing here.  Are you saying that
> Alfvaen is constantly achieving a winning condition, over and over again,
> since his score went infinite (something I still claim didn't happen)?  Or
> are you saying that once his score went infinite, Alfvaen, well, how shall
> I put it... that the title, or state of being, or what have you, of having
> "achieved a winning condition" was confered upon Alfvaen?  Or am I
> completely misunderstanding you?  As I see it, neither of the two
> possibilities I just put forward have much to support them.

I was in fact clutching at straws. I', pretty sure that you are right here.

> Well, there isn't any reason other than that is the way such things are
> commonly interpreted in Acka.  But as we all know game custom is pretty
> important around here.  I can't even begin to cite all the proposals which
> use a format like yours, but were treated as a list of seperate effects.
> To name a few: All prolix proposals, 2955, 2981, 2989, 2251, 1978, 1987,
> 1118, 1121, and on and on and on.  These are just the results of scanning
> sections of the proposal archives at random.

I think breadbox explained this better than I could so I'll no respond to
this bit.

TGW.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 13:11:54 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Tom Walmsley" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: CFJs

> May I ask a favor of the Clerk of the Court? Would you be so kind as
> to publish a complete list of CFJs that are currently under appeal, to
> which Cortex each has been assigned, and, in the case of the Tweedle
> Cortex, which justice has been selected to stand in for Guy Fawkes'
> for each CFJ?

I discovered last night when I was starting to update the CFJ archives that
I'd made a major gaff by forgetting to assign most of the appeals for ages.
Therefore could you please tell me what CFJs you believe are currently
assigned to you in order that I can see exactly what's going on. Then, yes, I
will be able to do this (so if anyone wants to become a new justice with
Malenkai then now would be a good time).

TGW.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 13:23:11 -0400 (EDT)
From: Uri Bruck <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Ackanomic coat of arms

On Mon, 18 May 1998, JT wrote:

> 
> I hadn't actually thought about it, but I certainly find an amount of
> beauty in Slakko's suggestions.  Normally couchant, rampant and dormant
> are reserved for livingcreatures, and I like the entension of them to
> 'computer life' so to speak :)
> 
> - --JT

I like them too, maybe it will even catch on in real life heraldry..

Niccolo Flychuck

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 13:40:58 -0400 (EDT)
From: Brian Raiter <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: CFJs

> I discovered last night when I was starting to update the CFJ
> archives that I'd made a major gaff by forgetting to assign most of
> the appeals for ages.  Therefore could you please tell me what CFJs
> you believe are currently assigned to you in order that I can see
> exactly what's going on.

CFJ 580 is in the hands of Alfvaen and ThinMan (as I declined to judge
this one), and you have definitely assigned CFCJ 162 and CFJ 583 to
myself and ThinMan. This is the extent of my knowledge.

breadbox

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 13:43:00 -0400 (EDT)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Acka: Potato

The Gingham Wearer has found the Magic Potato this week.

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/ )
Song In My Head--Led Zeppelin:Black Dog
Current Book--Michael Coney:Cat Karina
This is not a rebel song, this is 'O Canada'!

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 14:04:14 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jonathan David Amery <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: CFJ 593 (J.M. Bear)

On Mon, 18 May 1998, Aaron V. Humphrey wrote:

> 
> > > > It is also an incredibly cool CFJ. I almost can't believe that you
> > > > didn't plan this - it's too perfect.
> 
> > > What, us, plan anything?  <innocent look>  I cannot tell a lie--TGW
> > > emailed me a few weeks back to ask if I had any good ideas for amendments
> > > to Rule 340, and already had the idea about "forgetting" the final
> > > delimiter and putting the text giving me points already into the Rule.
> 
> >  I believe you will get the Goose.
> 
> I don't believe we ever hooked up the Goose to the CWCFJ process, just
> the PWCFJ.  Of course, anyone with a Foul Fowl card can try to tear it
> away from The Gingham Wearer, whom it's annoyed at because of that
> Ackanomicon thing...
> 
 Ah, no; because you will *still* have a winning condition after winning.

 H*bert.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 14:12:22 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jonathan David Amery <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Scam Attempt

On Mon, 18 May 1998, JT wrote:
> On Mon, 18 May 1998, John Bollinger wrote:
> >JT wrote:
> >>On Mon, 18 May 1998, K2 wrote:
> >>>Jonathan David Amery wrote:
> >>>>  In the event that this *doesn't* work I suggest that SPAM creates a rule
> >>>> numbered with the lowest legal positive integer greater than -1 and the
> >>>> following SPAM delimited text:
> >>>>
> >>>>  I then create a trinket valued at 1A$ with a description and name that is
> >>>> identical to the text above enclosed in the last two ".
> >>>
> >>>Under what conditions was this trinket created?
> >>
> >>I would also like to know this, so that I can Harf it into the trinket
> >>pages if needed.
> >
> >It would appear that it was not created under any circumstances, as the
> >maybe could-be would-be creator obviously did not include sufficient
> >information to unambiguously specify.
> 
> That's fine by me :) Less work :)
> 
 In which case in the event that:

 a) the trinket discussed has been created and the condition that was
mentioned in the first paragraph of text preceded by five > characters was
false then I destroy the trinket that is beind discussed.

 b) the trinket discussed has not been created and the condition that was
mentioned in the first paragraph of text preceded by five > characters was
true then I create a trinket with name and description that is the
following " delimited name "but Gnhomb is a god" and has a value of A$1. 

 H*bert.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 16:14:25 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Tom Walmsley" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Potato

> The Gingham Wearer has found the Magic Potato this week.

Yay! Finally a chance to amend Beldin's pants! Except somebody went and
repealed them. D'oh!

TGW.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 16:14:28 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Tom Walmsley" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Justices, appeals and what have you

I think I've worked out the situation with the justices and appeals now too.
There are two distinct threads so this is quite nasty.

In the first thread saaremaa/Malenkai has been selected to cover for the
vacationing Guy Fawkes and the appeals are as follows (T&T standing for
Tweedledee and Tweedledum and SC standing for the entity formerly known as
the supreme court):

580 Alfvaen & ThinMan
C162 SC
583 SC
567 T&T
570 T&T
573 T&T
575 SC
580 T&T
584 T&T
587 SC
591 SC

In the second thread ThinMan has been selected to stand in for the
vacationing Guy Fawkes and  the CFJs have been assigned to the same cortices
with the exception of 580 and 584 which were never appealed because Randy
Hall wasn't a player and 587 which T&T got. I'll leave it /dev/joe, ThinMan
and Malenkai/saaremaa to work out what's going on and make up for my many
mistakes. Fortunately 584 got assigned to Twee and Twee so they can work on
that first and then the rest should be reasonably simple.

TGW, CotC.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 17:10:22 -0400 (EDT)
From: JT <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Ackanomic coat of arms

On Mon, 18 May 1998, Brian Raiter wrote:
>>>>**     **  ***  **
>>>>* *   **   *    * *
>>>>*       *   *
>
>This doesn't take include many of the various rotations and
>reflections, though.

reflections and other orientations can be gotten, there are in fact even
heraldic conventions for doing so :)

>>> Since the life-glider (as far as I can tell) has never been used in
>>> heraldry before, we will set precedent.  The Heraldic Definition of a 
>>> life glider is the geometric shaped represent by the first graphic above
>>> to wit:
>>>   **
>>>   * *
>>>   *
>
>I personally think it should be:
>
>        *
>         *
>       ***

Any particular reason? (since this is just a rotation of the first)

- --JT

[-------------------------------------------------------------------------]
[ Practice random kindness and senseless acts of beauty.                  ]
[ It's hard to sieze the day when you must first grapple with the morning ]
[-------------------------------------------------------------------------]

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 17:16:00 -0400 (EDT)
From: [email-masked] (John Bollinger)
Subject: Re:  Acka: Justices, appeals and what have you

TGW wrote:
>I think I've worked out the situation with the justices and appeals now too.
>There are two distinct threads so this is quite nasty.

This should not be the case.  saaremaa/Malenkai, whether a player or not,
was not a Justice when Guy Fawkes went on vacation.  [Correct me if I am
wrong.]  He should not be elligible for random selection to fill in for Guy.

And if your dice really randomly selected saarema/Malenkai to fill in in
this situation (ignoring for a moment the fact that he was inelligible) then
they oughtta be shot -- send 'em to the glue factory and get some new, less
perverse ones.  :-)

ThinMan

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 17:17:57 -0400 (EDT)
From: [email-masked] (John Bollinger)
Subject: Re:  Acka: Justices, appeals and what have you

Oh, and who really has CFJ 580?

>580 Alfvaen & ThinMan

[...]

>580 T&T

ThinMan

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 17:33:44 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Tom Walmsley" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Justices, appeals and what have you

> >I think I've worked out the situation with the justices and appeals now
too.
> >There are two distinct threads so this is quite nasty.
> 
> This should not be the case.  saaremaa/Malenkai, whether a player or not,
> was not a Justice when Guy Fawkes went on vacation.  [Correct me if I am
> wrong.]  He should not be elligible for random selection to fill in for
Guy.

Tragically, I think that because I only just got round to doing this he
should be eligible, but I'm not sure. Feel free to CFJ it if you want to make
things more chaotic :-).

> And if your dice really randomly selected saarema/Malenkai to fill in in
> this situation (ignoring for a moment the fact that he was inelligible)
then
> they oughtta be shot -- send 'em to the glue factory and get some new, less
> perverse ones.  :-)

They did, really they did. And I would shoot them but I'd probably be left
without a computer since it's really a simple dice program that I've got.

TGW.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 17:33:46 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Tom Walmsley" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Justices, appeals and what have you

> Oh, and who really has CFJ 580?
> 
> >580 Alfvaen & ThinMan
> 
> [...]
> 
> >580 T&T

Alfvaen and ThinMan. (sorry).

TGW.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 17:34:58 -0400 (EDT)
From: JT <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Scam Attempt

On Mon, 18 May 1998, Jonathan David Amery wrote:
>On Mon, 18 May 1998, JT wrote:
>> On Mon, 18 May 1998, John Bollinger wrote:
>> >JT wrote:
>> >>On Mon, 18 May 1998, K2 wrote:
>> >>>Jonathan David Amery wrote:
>> >>>>  In the event that this *doesn't* work I suggest that SPAM creates a rule
>> >>>> numbered with the lowest legal positive integer greater than -1 and the
>> >>>> following SPAM delimited text:
>> >>>>
>> >>>>  I then create a trinket valued at 1A$ with a description and name that is
>> >>>> identical to the text above enclosed in the last two ".
>> >>>
>> >>>Under what conditions was this trinket created?
>> >>
>> >>I would also like to know this, so that I can Harf it into the trinket
>> >>pages if needed.
>> >
>> >It would appear that it was not created under any circumstances, as the
>> >maybe could-be would-be creator obviously did not include sufficient
>> >information to unambiguously specify.
>> 
>> That's fine by me :) Less work :)
>> 
> In which case in the event that:
>
> a) the trinket discussed has been created and the condition that was
>mentioned in the first paragraph of text preceded by five > characters was
>false then I destroy the trinket that is beind discussed.
>
> b) the trinket discussed has not been created and the condition that was
>mentioned in the first paragraph of text preceded by five > characters was
>true then I create a trinket with name and description that is the
>following " delimited name "but Gnhomb is a god" and has a value of A$1. 

Somewhere in here, in this tortured twist of logical connective, a trinket
might or might not have been created.  

H*bert, I cannot follow from the above under which conditions the trinket
did or didn't get created.

Could you, in plain english, without reference to other documents :) give
the conditions for this trinket getting created?  (as a note, I really
hate trinkets created in a threadsplit :( and in the future will probably
harf them as if they had happened until the split is resolved.)

- --JT

[-------------------------------------------------------------------------]
[ Practice random kindness and senseless acts of beauty.                  ]
[ It's hard to sieze the day when you must first grapple with the morning ]
[-------------------------------------------------------------------------]

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 18:13:03 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jonathan David Amery <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Scam Attempt

On Mon, 18 May 1998, JT wrote:
> On Mon, 18 May 1998, Jonathan David Amery wrote:
> >On Mon, 18 May 1998, JT wrote:
> >> On Mon, 18 May 1998, John Bollinger wrote:
> >> >JT wrote:
> >> >>On Mon, 18 May 1998, K2 wrote:
> >> >>>Jonathan David Amery wrote:
> >> >>>>  In the event that this *doesn't* work I suggest that SPAM creates a rule
> >> >>>> numbered with the lowest legal positive integer greater than -1 and the
> >> >>>> following SPAM delimited text:
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>  I then create a trinket valued at 1A$ with a description and name that is
> >> >>>> identical to the text above enclosed in the last two ".
> >> >>>
> >> >>>Under what conditions was this trinket created?
> >> >>
> >> >>I would also like to know this, so that I can Harf it into the trinket
> >> >>pages if needed.
> >> >
> >> >It would appear that it was not created under any circumstances, as the
> >> >maybe could-be would-be creator obviously did not include sufficient
> >> >information to unambiguously specify.
> >> 
> >> That's fine by me :) Less work :)
> >> 
> > In which case in the event that:
> >
> > a) the trinket discussed has been created and the condition that was
> >mentioned in the first paragraph of text preceded by five > characters was
> >false then I destroy the trinket that is beind discussed.
> >
> > b) the trinket discussed has not been created and the condition that was
> >mentioned in the first paragraph of text preceded by five > characters was
> >true then I create a trinket with name and description that is the
> >following " delimited name "but Gnhomb is a god" and has a value of A$1. 
> 
> Somewhere in here, in this tortured twist of logical connective, a trinket
> might or might not have been created.  
> 
> H*bert, I cannot follow from the above under which conditions the trinket
> did or didn't get created.
> 
> Could you, in plain english, without reference to other documents :) give
> the conditions for this trinket getting created?  (as a note, I really
> hate trinkets created in a threadsplit :( and in the future will probably
> harf them as if they had happened until the split is resolved.)
> 
 O.K. Right.

 In the event that Slakko's scam works then I have the trinket.
 In the event that it doesn't I have 1A$ instead.

 H*bert.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 18:17:00 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jonathan David Amery <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Someone call a CSSR

Proposal 3067:

"The butler may then not be used until a period of rime equal to twice the
time it was performing this duty has passed."      ^^^^

 That word should read "time".

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 18:35:20 -0400 (EDT)
From: JT <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Scam Attempt

On Mon, 18 May 1998, Jonathan David Amery wrote:
> In the event that Slakko's scam works then I have the trinket.
> In the event that it doesn't I have 1A$ instead.

Ahh.. okay :)
In that case, i will wait until it is decided whether the scam worked or
not before creating this trinket even though it happened at the time of
your initial message if it did happen. 

- --JT

[-------------------------------------------------------------------------]
[ Practice random kindness and senseless acts of beauty.                  ]
[ It's hard to sieze the day when you must first grapple with the morning ]
[-------------------------------------------------------------------------]

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 21:51:36 -0400 (EDT)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Re: Acka: Justices, appeals and what have you

>I think I've worked out the situation with the justices and appeals now too.
>There are two distinct threads so this is quite nasty.

>In the first thread saaremaa/Malenkai has been selected to cover for the
>vacationing Guy Fawkes and the appeals are as follows (T&T standing for
>Tweedledee and Tweedledum and SC standing for the entity formerly known as
>the supreme court):

>580 Alfvaen & ThinMan

I still am not sure if I am an Acting Justice in any thread(or for any CFJ),
because from my reading of the appropriate Rules I am not required to serve
as Acting Justice while there are any two Justices available who are not
disqualified from judging.  I am not a Justice myself, only Praetor.  And
I apologize for having asserted my Acting Justiceship previously; I hadn't
read the Supreme Cortex rules carefully.

- --
- --Alfvaen (Web page:http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/)
Current Album--Blur
Current Book--Michael Coney:Cat Karina
"Hi there, my name is Legion, and I'll be your server for this evening."

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 21:52:14 -0400 (EDT)
From: a33s23 <[email-masked]>
Subject: [none]

Authenticated sender is <[email-masked]>
Subject:  s5  h2
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

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Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 22:31:37 -0400 (EDT)
From: Randy Hall <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: cortex

I create a cortex named 'The Cortex of the Golden Frog'.

saaremaa
Justice

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 23:59:31 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Justices, appeals and what have you

Alfvaen wrote:
> >580 Alfvaen & ThinMan
> 
> I still am not sure if I am an Acting Justice in any thread(or for any CFJ),
> because from my reading of the appropriate Rules I am not required to serve
> as Acting Justice while there are any two Justices available who are not
> disqualified from judging.  I am not a Justice myself, only Praetor.  And
> I apologize for having asserted my Acting Justiceship previously; I hadn't
> read the Supreme Cortex rules carefully.

I believe Alfvaen is correct.  This justice seat was filled because
Breadbox exercised his R417 (Justices Rock) privilege to not have to
judge this CFJ, and R417 says the replacement justice is selected as
if that justice went on vacation.  So, the seat is filled by R416,
which takes precedence over R425.  R416 requires the acting justice
to be chosen among non-vacationing justices not in that cortex, and I
have been a non-vacationing Justice since CFJ580 was appealed, so
either I should have been chosen, or a random choice should have been
made between me and Malenkai/saaremaa in the thread where he is a
Justice, and I should have been chosen in the other thread.

I will work on a proposal to fix up all the assorted inconsistencies
left in the Justice/Praetor rules because of that Cortex proposal.

/dev/joe
Justice

------------------------------

End of ackanomic digest V3 #160
*******************************