Subject: ackanomic digest V3 #505
From: [email-masked] (ackanomic digest)
To: [email-masked]

ackanomic digest       Monday, February 2 1998       Volume 03 : Number 505

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 14:14:33 -0500 (EST)
From: "Vivian Norwood" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: CFJ 518 (FALSE)

Clerk of the Courts
- -----------------------------------------------------------------------
Call For Judgement 518 - January 26, 1998
Subject:  Harfer Fee 
Initiator: Slakko
Judge: Slagothor (declined)
Judge 2:  K 2 (selected January 27, 1998, 9:30 a.m.)
Judgement: FALSE

Statement:

There is an Organization called "the standard Harfer Fee".

Reasoning:

Rule 1007 states that 
>An attempt to perform this action fails if, at the time of the attempt,
>(1) the organization does not own at least the standard Harfer Fee, or
>(2) it is not legal for the organization to have the specified new name. 

At the time that The Gingham Wearer supported the suggestion for "the
standard Harfer Fee" to change its name to "Klingon", Slakko owned "at
least the standard Harfer fee".  Hence by Rule 1007 the attempt to change
the name of "the standard Harfer Fee" failed, and hence it is still called
"the standard Harfer Fee".

Judges Reasoning:

Rule 505 states:
The standard Harfer Fee is A$25.

Thus when rule 505 came into its current form, the organisation that
existed prior to that, with the same name, was changed into A$25.

Even were this not the case, Rule 505 clearly defines what the standard
Harfer Fee is (A$25).
Using this definition, it would seem fair to say that where the rules
are concerned, the phrase "the standard harfer fee" is equivalent to
"A$25".

Given that "the standard harfer fee" is a rule defined term, the most
reasonable interpretation of rule 1007 would be that that, at least A$25
is required for an organisation to change its name, rather than
ownership of a particular trinket which happens to have a phrase in its
name which means $A25.

If the organisation "the standard Harfer Fee" had continued to exist
after rule 505 was altered to its current form, then since the
appropriate protocol was followed, that organisation would have changed
its name to Klingon

Either way, at the time that this CFJ was submitted, no organisation
called the standard harfer fee existed.

This CFJ is FALSE.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 14:22:51 -0500 (EST)
From: "Vivian Norwood" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: CFJ 529 (Balsamic Dragon)

I accept.

Balsamic Dragon

- ----------
> From: Vivian Norwood <[email-masked]>
> To: Ackanomic <[email-masked]>
> Subject: Acka: CFJ 529 (Balsamic Dragon)
> Date: Monday, February 02, 1998 2:02 PM
> 
> Clerk of the Courts
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> Call For Judgement 529 - February 2, 1998
> Subject: Paradox Win
> Initiator: Slakko
> Judge: Balsamic Dragon  (selected February 2, 1998, 2:00 p.m.)
> Judgement:
> 
> Statement:
> 
> It appears equally legal and illegal for Slakko to perform the action of
> converting the Scam PWCFJ Attempt trinket into Ackadollars.
> 
> Reasoning:
> 
> This is a Paradox Win CFJ.
> 
> The Scam PWCFJ Attempt trinket was only created in the event that CFJ 483
> had a final verdict of TRUE.
> 
> CFJ 483 was initially judged on 10 December 1997, at 22:38:39 Acka time
(I
> believe).  It was judged TRUE.
> CFJ 483 was appealed to the Supreme Court, and the verdict was overturned
> to FALSE at 19:26:58 Acka Time on 16 December 1997.  This was publicly
> knowable at that time.
> 
> By Rule 215, "All Judgements must be in accordance with all the rules in
> effect at the time judgement was invoked, and with respect to the game
> state at that time."  However, as the Supreme Court decision was not
> appealed within 4 days, it ceased to become appealable, and therefore
> became the official interpretation of the relevant rules. Hence Slakko's
> judgement was not in accordance with the rules, and this was publicly
> knowable less than 14 days after the judgement was made.  Hence Rule
701's
> "statute of limitations" does not apply, and hence the action of Slakko
> making the judgement did not occur.  Hence the judgement could not have
> been appealed. Hence the judgement was not overturned.  Hence Slakko's
> judgement was not against the rules.  Hence it was appealed, etc. etc.
> 
> It is therefore impossible to determine whether the correct verdict is
> TRUE or FALSE, there is a paradox loop.  
> Hence it is impossible to determine whether or not Scam PWCFJ Attempt,
the
> Trinket, was created.
> Hence it is equally legal and illegal to convert Scam PWCFJ Attempt into
> cash as a public action.
> 
> 

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 14:41:18 -0500 (EST)
From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: CFJ 523 (TRUE (upheld))

On Mon, 2 Feb 1998, Vivian Norwood wrote:

> Call For Judgement 523
>   Subject: Slakko's Alleged Win
> Initiator: The Gingham Wearer
>     Judge: Crackfoo (selected January 27, 1998, 3:45 p.m.)
> Judgement: TRUE
> Appealed by Slakko
> Judgement: TRUE (upheld)

Fair enough.
> 
> Statement:
> 
> Slakko did not win a cycle of Ackanomic on January 7th 1998.
> 
> Supreme Court's Reasoning:
> 
> The appealer's arguments are wholly out of line with the
> long-established game custom that a misspelled word is "unambiguous"
> if the correct word, in context, can be determined beyond reasonable
> doubt. Spelling errors worse than those offered above have been
> accepted in the past, and the Court can see no tenable argument that
> this is not a valid interpretation of the rules. If it were not, then
> the vast majority of past misspellings would be considered ambiguous,
> and the rules would undoubtedly contain at least one paradox. (And
> furthermore, the date in the statement under judgement would not be
> recognized as an unambiguous misspelling of "January 27th", and this CFJ
> would be trivially False.)
> 
> As the rule states that misspellings are only recognized as such
> during "rule-sanctioned spelling correction", it seems clear that the
> Agenda Hat will not recognize the twice-quoted message as containing
> misspellings.
> 
> It has also been argued elsewhere that Rule 340 cannot do what it
> claims, as by causing misspellings to be treated "as if the misspelled
> word were spelled correctly", the rule no longer allows itself to
> recognize the words as being misspelled. The Court disagrees with this
> line of reasoning, if for no other reason than Rule 340 itself is an
> instance of rule-sanctioned spelling correction.
> 
> Although the secondary issue of "player attributes" is immaterial to
> the verdict, the Court will make one observation in that direction,
> solely for the record. Contrary to some players' claims, there is one
> place in the rules where the term "attributes" is used to refer to
> something that a player can acquire, and that is Rule 854, "Ackanomic
> Institute of Genetic Replication". However, note that the mutations
> themselves are not described as attributes, but rather their effects,
> which are not currently listed on the Player/Entity page.

Actually, according to the text of Rule 854, the "attributes" are
attributes of the mutations. 
We also have attributes of the Frankenstein Monster, but there is nothing
which describes attributes of _players_.  I would ask the Supreme Court if
this is a reasonable interpretation.

Yours,
Slakko

- -- 
Duncan C. "" Richer aka
Slakko the Really Lost Warner Brother - http://dcr24.quns.cam.ac.uk/
Queens' College -- PhD, Pure Maths, Graph Theory -- Cambridge University
Acka - RuneMaker, Chess-Umpire, Map-Harfer, Senator, Wearing Agenda Hat

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 14:45:10 -0500 (EST)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Re: Acka: Caped Crusader Collectibles

> 	I create a trinket worth A$5 called "The Caped Crusader Collectible
> Lunchbox-Lexical Equivalence Edition" with this description "This shows a
> picture of the Caped Crusader in full costume breaking the arm of a
> criminal who exploited Malenkai's Loophole.  On the back it says 'The Caped
> Crusader Collectible Lunchbox-Lexical Equivelance Edition.  Collect all
> four.'"

Ooh boy!  And since it's got a typo, it's even _more_ collectible!

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/ )
Current Album--Roby Hitchcock & The Egyptians:Queen Elvis
Current Book--Barbara Smucker:Underground To Canada
Fabled reader with jaded, roving eye seized by quickened impulse to expand budget.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 14:46:07 -0500 (EST)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Acka: Potato

Crackfoo has found the Magic Potato.

(Boy, my random number generator sure likes Crackfoo...first I select em
for CFJ's when I was Acting CotC, then e find the Machine, and now e finds
the Potato...)

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/ )
Current Album--Roby Hitchcock & The Egyptians:Queen Elvis
Current Book--Barbara Smucker:Underground To Canada
This is a perfect world; I'm riding on an incline

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 14:46:37 -0500 (EST)
From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Trinket Fun

I hereby creat a Trynket, worth A$10, with the name "A Fun Little
Scam Win", and the description:
"This one is also designed to support a scam win.  Like the last Scam
Trinket, I don't know whether or not this one actually has been created.
A sort of Schrodinger's Trinket."

- -- 
Duncan C. "" Richer aka
Slakko the Really Lost Warner Brother - http://dcr24.quns.cam.ac.uk/
Queens' College -- PhD, Pure Maths, Graph Theory -- Cambridge University
Acka - RuneMaker, Chess-Umpire, Map-Harfer, Senator, Wearing Agenda Hat

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 14:56:15 -0500 (EST)
From: Brian Raiter <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Um ... "Whoops"

The text of Proposal 2610 was "Repeal Rule 564.21". At the time it was
accepted, I mistakenly stated that this was a Null Proposal, as there
was no such rule. Slakko correctly pointed out that it had been seven
days since ThinMan posted his Discovery for a Circle of Mystic
Protection, so it had become a Blueprint by then.

My only excuse for making this kind of mistake is that we have had few
new Blueprints since the Blueprint Re-org (before then, Blueprints
were separate documents, and not part of the rules themselves). I
apologize again for making such mistakes, particularly in light of the
following.

It appears that we all overlooked the fact that Valaraukar was also a
Blueprint, and in fact became one before ThinMan's Discovery was
accepted. Thus it seems that, much to my chagrin, Proposal 2610 has in
fact repealed Valaraukar's Blueprint instead. (It cannot even be
construed as an unambiguous spelling error, since the proposal gave no
indication of which rule it intended to repeal other than its number.)

Valaraukar became a Blueprint on January 18th at 20:41.
The Circle became a Blueprint on January 24th at 08:56.
Proposal 2610 was accepted on January 25th at 07:43.

Only the first action occurred more than two weeks ago (just barely),
and I don't believe that the two-week pragmatism clause affects this
situation. I mean, it cannot honestly be argued that everyone thought
Valaraukar's Blueprint did not exist. Also, the rules pretty much
exempt errors made solely by the Rule-Harfer from this effect (which
is good, because otherwise I would have far too much power over the
game).

I've gone back and reread the Blueprint rules, and I believe what I've
stated here is correct. If I'm wrong, I would appreciate someone
pointing out to me what I've missed. I would also welcome opinions as
to the fate of Valaraukar the Gadget, as I'm not sure if it still
exists or not, as the Blueprint was repealed instead of being
Debunked. (Though it definitely does not have any of its questionable
capabilities if it does exist ... so much for yesterday's party.)

breadbox

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 15:07:08 -0500 (EST)
From: Brian Raiter <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: CFJ 523 (TRUE (upheld))

>> Although the secondary issue of "player attributes" is immaterial to
>> the verdict, the Court will make one observation in that direction,
>> solely for the record. Contrary to some players' claims, there is one
>> place in the rules where the term "attributes" is used to refer to
>> something that a player can acquire, and that is Rule 854, "Ackanomic
>> Institute of Genetic Replication". However, note that the mutations
>> themselves are not described as attributes, but rather their effects,
>> which are not currently listed on the Player/Entity page.
> 
> Actually, according to the text of Rule 854, the "attributes" are
> attributes of the mutations. 
> We also have attributes of the Frankenstein Monster, but there is nothing
> which describes attributes of _players_.  I would ask the Supreme Court if
> this is a reasonable interpretation.

Rule 854 states: "... he receives that mutation and any special
attributes associated with it ..." and "he shall cease to have both
the mutation and any special attributes associated with it."

Thus one could argue that the player is receiving attributes, as well
as the mutation, and so this would be the only rule that describes how
a player can obtain something that the rules describe as attributes.

As was mentioned in the reasoning, the Court was not putting forth any
opinions regarding the validity of this argument.

breadbox

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 15:13:58 -0500 (EST)
From: "Gavin M. Doig" <[email-masked]>
Subject: acka: 5 line apology

I
am
very
very
sorry. ;-)

Rex Mundi.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 15:14:38 -0500 (EST)
From: "Gavin M. Doig" <[email-masked]>
Subject: acka: Rafting

The team consisting of myself, Fortunato, The Gingham Wearer, and else...if
wishes to attempt to go white water rafting on the Ackanomian River.

Rex Mundi.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 15:19:41 -0500 (EST)
From: Mitchell Harding <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Harf and related issues

I am working on a web page dedicated to harf. It's URL is:
http://ccwf.cc.utexas.edu/~mitcharf/harfproj.html

If you know of any harf related items on the internet that I am missing,
please let me know.

Thanks,
Robert Sevin
Harf Harf Harf

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 16:13:20 -0500 (EST)
From: [email-masked]
Subject: RE: Acka: Not Subscribed

> K2 wrote:
> 
> >  Since my induction 'in to the fold' (25 Nov. '97) I have:
> >     received 538 Ackranomic related messages
> >     totalling 1306 kb
> > 
> > thus:    1306/9 = 145 kb/day on average over the past 9 days.
> > 
> Ahhhh.  Volume is picking up again.  It feels like the good ole days.
> :-)

Im downloading at the moment 2000+ emails. I have not checked my 
email for a month and I think the most of the emails will be coming 
from ackanomic maillists. I was only subscribed at the lists for 
ack-games aspecially virusses.
And I stopped reading the emails from the other acka maillists.

The old players will know me under the name of CarsesraC.

I have just send the command to unsubscribe me from all the maillists 
of ackanomics. So its bye to you all.
Good luck and happiness in the game(world) that is called ackanomic.

Jeroen M.W. van Dijk       

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 16:22:01 -0500 (EST)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Re: Acka: new Player

> Ok, can we view this and the preceeding members acceptances and just letHachiman
> in, or should we all spam the main list again to accept him?  If
> necessary I approve Hachiman's request for entry into the Razor Boomerangs
> (again)

For now I will consider this to have succeeded, just to save bandwidth.
And since e is non-voting, it won't affect your unity votes either way...

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/ )
Song In My Head--The Golden Palominos:Boy(Go)
Current Book--Barbara Smucker:Underground To Canada
I want to thank you for putting me back in my snail shell

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 16:22:29 -0500 (EST)
From: [email-masked] (Dice server)
Subject: Acka: SBoC Random OC determination

- -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

Dice rolls requested by: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Rolls also sent to:
    [email-masked]

# Player: Rex Mundi
# I am using the dice server to determine the random otzma card
# delivered from the spell book of chorg based on the following
# schedule:
# 1 - go fish
# 2 - map shard
# 3 - untouch me
# 4 - share my expenses
# 5 - share my income
# 6 - swinging sale
# 7 - tactical retreat
# 8 - paratroop
# 9 - foul fowl
# 10 - truthseeker
# 11 - fix my gadget
# 12 - scientist for a day
# 13 - art thief
# 14 - skeleton key
# 15 - grave robber
# 16 - summon tornado

No. of sides on every die:     16
No. of dice for every roll:     1
No. of dice rolls requested:    1
No. of rolls per line:          1

      3

Information on the dice server:
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Original message follows:
> From [email-masked]  Mon Feb  2 13:22:07 1998
> Received: (from smtp@localhost) by xkey.com
>       id NAA28860 for <[email-masked]>; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:22:07 -0800
> Received: from edtntnt2-port-168.agt.net(209.115.133.168) by xkey.com via smtp (V1.3)
>       id sma028853; Mon Feb  2 13:21:57 1998
> Received: (from alfvaen@localhost) by concordia.telusplanet.net (8.7.6/8.7.3) id NAA01163 for [email-masked]; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:18:57 -0700
> Message-Id: <[email-masked]>
> Subject: Acka: Chorg
> To: [email-masked]
> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 13:18:56 -0700 (MST)
> Reply-To: [email-masked]
> From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
> Content-Type: text
> 
> 
> #P [email-masked]
> #S 16
> #D 1
> #R 1
> #L 1
> #T Acka: SBoC Random OC determination
> 
> #C Player: Rex Mundi
> #C I am using the dice server to determine the random otzma card
> #C delivered from the spell book of chorg based on the following
> #C schedule:
> #C 1 - go fish
> #C 2 - map shard
> #C 3 - untouch me
> #C 4 - share my expenses
> #C 5 - share my income
> #C 6 - swinging sale
> #C 7 - tactical retreat
> #C 8 - paratroop
> #C 9 - foul fowl
> #C 10 - truthseeker
> #C 11 - fix my gadget
> #C 12 - scientist for a day
> #C 13 - art thief
> #C 14 - skeleton key
> #C 15 - grave robber
> #C 16 - summon tornado
> 
> 

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 16:37:02 -0500 (EST)
From: Uri Bruck <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Proposal 2636 accepted

On Mon, 2 Feb 1998, Duncan Richer wrote:

> On Mon, 2 Feb 1998, Uri Bruck wrote:
> > On Sun, 1 Feb 1998, Duncan Richer wrote:
> > 
> > > 
> > > 8c says that Church Founders count as Priests for the purposes of
> > > membership.  It does not say which church they are priests of, so section
> > > 11 overrules this and says they are not a priest.
> > > Also, all players who were ordained under 4a or 4b of the rule were not
> > > ordained as priests of a particular church, just as priests.
> > > Therefore no church in existence prior to this rule being passed had any
> > > priests after this rule was passed, and hence when this rule was passed
> > > all churches became Cults.
> > 
> > I disagree. I explicitly ordained you as a Priest of the Church of Odo
> > some time back.
> 
> But at the time the rules did not recognise distinctions between priests
> of different Churches, so you only had authority to ordain me as a Priest.
> Full stop.

This still does not change the status of Founders. Precedence only comes
into play when there is conflict between two rules, or in this case two
sections of a rule.  The rules doesn't say that Founders are Priests, it
says that they count as Priests for purposes of membership. Elsewhere it
says that anything a Priest can do a Founder can do as well. 
There is no conflict with newly added text, and therefore section 11
doesn't get to exercise precedence.

Niccolo Flychuck

Still Founder of Odo.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 16:38:01 -0500 (EST)
From: Towsner <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: CFCJ 154 (TRUE)

>could be far more Annoying than the Annoyingness itself.  I chose not to
>have Rex Mundi cover else...if's court costs because of this, and would
	I'm the Caped Crusader.  I don't pay the court cost.

- --
- -Henry Towsner, AKA else...if, The Fearless Alibi Posesser, Laefu, and Yilran

	<[email-masked]>

	Success is the child of audacity.
		-Benjamin Disraeli

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 16:38:05 -0500 (EST)
From: Towsner <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Um ... "Whoops"

>I've gone back and reread the Blueprint rules, and I believe what I've
>stated here is correct. If I'm wrong, I would appreciate someone
>pointing out to me what I've missed. I would also welcome opinions as
>to the fate of Valaraukar the Gadget, as I'm not sure if it still
>exists or not, as the Blueprint was repealed instead of being
>Debunked. (Though it definitely does not have any of its questionable
>capabilities if it does exist ... so much for yesterday's party.)
	I don't think monster blueprints get added to the rules like other
ones do.

- --
- -Henry Towsner, AKA else...if, The Fearless Alibi Posesser, Laefu, and Yilran

	<[email-masked]>

	Success is the child of audacity.
		-Benjamin Disraeli

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 16:38:09 -0500 (EST)
From: Towsner <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: acka: 5 line apology

>I
>am
>very
>very
>sorry. ;-)
	I have an incredible urge to appeal the CFCJ and demand a harsher
penalty.

- --
- -Henry Towsner, AKA else...if, The Fearless Alibi Posesser, Laefu, and Yilran

	<[email-masked]>

	Success is the child of audacity.
		-Benjamin Disraeli

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 16:38:14 -0500 (EST)
From: Towsner <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: CSR 126

>I object to this CSR.  If proposal 2673 passes, this amendment will
>clash somewhat with the rework of rule 212.  More importantly,
>if this CSR goes through before 2673 (possibly) passes (and it is
>scheduled to), 2673 will make a mess, by only partially working.
>
>I encourage someone else to object as well, and then try again after
>the fate of 2673 is known.
	Sure.  I object to CSR 126.

- --
- -Henry Towsner, AKA else...if, The Fearless Alibi Posesser, Laefu, and Yilran

	<[email-masked]>

	Success is the child of audacity.
		-Benjamin Disraeli

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 16:50:32 -0500 (EST)
From: John Frederic Mc Coy <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: CSR 126

On Mon, 2 Feb 1998, Towsner wrote:

> >I object to this CSR.  If proposal 2673 passes, this amendment will
> >clash somewhat with the rework of rule 212.  More importantly,
> >if this CSR goes through before 2673 (possibly) passes (and it is
> >scheduled to), 2673 will make a mess, by only partially working.
> >
> >I encourage someone else to object as well, and then try again after
> >the fate of 2673 is known.
> 	Sure.  I object to CSR 126.

With this objection, CSR 126 fails.  My apologies to Malenkai for stepping
on the toes of his proposal, I will indeed wait until after its fate is
determined to try again.

                                     - CSSR Vynd

[email-masked]

> 
> --
> -Henry Towsner, AKA else...if, The Fearless Alibi Posesser, Laefu, and Yilran
> 
> 	<[email-masked]>
> 
> 	Success is the child of audacity.
> 		-Benjamin Disraeli
> 
> 
> 

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 17:21:52 -0500 (EST)
From: "Gavin M. Doig" <[email-masked]>
Subject: acka: 5 line apology

First, let me apologise for my apology with one word per line. I thought it
was funny...
Next, I would like to apologise for being Annoying. Although I realised I
was being Annoying, I did not intend to be annoying.
I thought that, if my attempt to pay the org had not been enough to satisfy
the requirement of paying the standard harfer fee, the A$25 would have
automatically gone to the Treasury.
At least I didn't to something _really_ evil, like saying the earth was
flat. Now that would be a serious crime. And that must be at least 5 lines.

Rex Mundi.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 17:22:09 -0500 (EST)
From: [email-masked] (Dice server)
Subject: Acka: Rafting Results

- -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

Dice rolls requested by: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Rolls also sent to:
    [email-masked]

# Players: Rex Mundi, Fortunato, The Gingham Wearer, else...if
# 1) Water Pollution
# 2) Lost In The Wilds
# 3) Capsized (Gadget Loss)
# 4) Capsized (Concussion)
# 5) Success!
# Alfvaen

No. of sides on every die:     19
No. of dice for every roll:     1
No. of dice rolls requested:    1
No. of rolls per line:          1

      1

Information on the dice server:
   DO NOT REPLY TO THIS MESSAGE!
   Replies to [email-masked] vanish into a seldom-read mailbox.

   For instructions on using the dice server, send a message with
   subject "help" to [email-masked], or see http://www.pbm.com/dice/

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      http://www.pbm.com/ds.html

Original message follows:
> From [email-masked]  Mon Feb  2 14:22:00 1998
> Received: (from smtp@localhost) by xkey.com
>       id OAA02329 for <[email-masked]>; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:22:00 -0800
> Received: from edtntnt1-port-11.agt.net(198.161.157.77) by xkey.com via smtp (V1.3)
>       id sma002327; Mon Feb  2 14:21:55 1998
> Received: (from alfvaen@localhost) by concordia.telusplanet.net (8.7.6/8.7.3) id PAA01497 for [email-masked]; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:02:39 -0700
> Message-Id: <[email-masked]>
> Subject: Acka: Rafting
> To: [email-masked]
> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:02:39 -0700 (MST)
> Reply-To: [email-masked]
> From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
> Content-Type: text
> 
> 
> 
> #P [email-masked]
> #S 19
> #D 1
> #R 1
> #L 1
> #T Acka: Rafting Results
> 
> #C Players: Rex Mundi, Fortunato, The Gingham Wearer, else...if
> #C 1) Water Pollution
> #C 2) Lost In The Wilds
> #C 3) Capsized (Gadget Loss)
> #C 4) Capsized (Concussion)
> #C 5) Success!
> #C
> #C Alfvaen
> 
> 

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 17:25:26 -0500 (EST)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Re: Acka: Um ... "Whoops"

> >I've gone back and reread the Blueprint rules, and I believe what I've
> >stated here is correct. If I'm wrong, I would appreciate someone
> >pointing out to me what I've missed. I would also welcome opinions as
> >to the fate of Valaraukar the Gadget, as I'm not sure if it still
> >exists or not, as the Blueprint was repealed instead of being
> >Debunked. (Though it definitely does not have any of its questionable
> >capabilities if it does exist ... so much for yesterday's party.)

> 	I don't think monster blueprints get added to the rules like other
> ones do.

Then where do they go?  We no longer have an extra-rulular document listing
all the Blueprints like we did before; all Blueprints are Rules of some
description.

On the other hand, I think it would be appropriate if Monster Blueprints
got added to a Rule 597 Rule suite instead of a Rule 594 one, but I don't
think one can interpret the Rules that way.

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/ )
Song In My Head--The Golden Palominos:Boy(Go)
Current Book--Barbara Smucker:Underground To Canada
I'm starting up a line of evil voodoo greeting cards.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 17:33:05 -0500 (EST)
From: Towsner <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Appeal

	Why not, I've got so few points anyway.
	I appeal CFCJ 154.
Reasoning:
	Rex Mundi was given a slap on the wrist punishment (literally).  We
should stamp out Malenkai's Loophole now with some serious punishments
before the problems gets worse.  Beyond that, Rex Mundi's "apology" showed
that he was not really repentant.

- --
- -Henry Towsner, AKA else...if, The Fearless Alibi Posesser, Laefu, and Yilran

	<[email-masked]>

	Success is the child of audacity.
		-Benjamin Disraeli

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 17:35:29 -0500 (EST)
From: [email-masked] (Dice server)
Subject: Acka: Rafting Results

- -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

Dice rolls requested by: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Rolls also sent to:
    [email-masked]

# Players: Rex Mundi, Fortunato, The Gingham Wearer, else...if
# 1) Water Pollution
# 2) Lost In The Wilds
# 3) Capsized (Gadget Loss)
# 4) Capsized (Concussion)
# 5) Success!
# Alfvaen

No. of sides on every die:      5
No. of dice for every roll:     1
No. of dice rolls requested:    1
No. of rolls per line:          1

      1

Information on the dice server:
   DO NOT REPLY TO THIS MESSAGE!
   Replies to [email-masked] vanish into a seldom-read mailbox.

   For instructions on using the dice server, send a message with
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      http://www.pbm.com/ds.html

Original message follows:
> From [email-masked]  Mon Feb  2 14:35:06 1998
> Received: (from smtp@localhost) by xkey.com
>       id OAA02824 for <[email-masked]>; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 14:35:06 -0800
> Received: from edtntnt1-port-11.agt.net(198.161.157.77) by xkey.com via smtp (V1.3)
>       id sma002812; Mon Feb  2 14:35:02 1998
> Received: (from alfvaen@localhost) by concordia.telusplanet.net (8.7.6/8.7.3) id PAA01697 for [email-masked]; Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:35:54 -0700
> Message-Id: <[email-masked]>
> Subject: Acka: Raft
> To: [email-masked]
> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 1998 15:35:53 -0700 (MST)
> Reply-To: [email-masked]
> From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
> Content-Type: text
> 
> 
> 
> #P [email-masked]
> #S 5
> #D 1
> #R 1
> #L 1
> #T Acka: Rafting Results
> 
> #C Players: Rex Mundi, Fortunato, The Gingham Wearer, else...if
> #C 1) Water Pollution
> #C 2) Lost In The Wilds
> #C 3) Capsized (Gadget Loss)
> #C 4) Capsized (Concussion)
> #C 5) Success!
> #C
> #C Alfvaen
> 
> 

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 17:35:44 -0500 (EST)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Acka: Sigh

Once again I see that I screwed up the dice server thing.  I keep forgetting
to put in the right number of sides when editing Malenkai's scripts.  :-)
Oddly enough, the number generated on the 19-sided die was still in the range
1-5, but I won't count it.  The next one will be authoritative.

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/ )
Current Album--Hunters & Collectors
Current Book--Barbara Smucker:Underground To Canada
I digress; you ramble; he's off-topic.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 17:42:58 -0500 (EST)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Acka: For Sure

Well, the Dice Server managed to return the exact same result as before,
so it is incontrovertible that Rex Mundi, The Gingham Wearer, else...if,
and Fortunato are in Gaol for one day.  (Whether that day begins at the
time Rex Mundi announced the departure of the rafting team or not, I
don't know...)

See, that's what you get for not bringing the Speaker along with you.
:-)

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/ )
Current Album--Hunters & Collectors
Current Book--Barbara Smucker:Underground To Canada
As long as I have you, I can endure all the troubles you inevitably bring.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 18:04:22 -0500 (EST)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Re: Acka: CFJ 523 (TRUE (upheld))

> The appealer's arguments are wholly out of line with the
> long-established game custom that a misspelled word is "unambiguous"
> if the correct word, in context, can be determined beyond reasonable
> doubt. Spelling errors worse than those offered above have been
> accepted in the past, and the Court can see no tenable argument that
> this is not a valid interpretation of the rules. If it were not, then
> the vast majority of past misspellings would be considered ambiguous,
> and the rules would undoubtedly contain at least one paradox. (And
> furthermore, the date in the statement under judgement would not be
> recognized as an unambiguous misspelling of "January 27th", and this CFJ
> would be trivially False.)

> As the rule states that misspellings are only recognized as such
> during "rule-sanctioned spelling correction", it seems clear that the
> Agenda Hat will not recognize the twice-quoted message as containing
> misspellings.

I'm tempted to appeal this, although I realize that I can't really introduce
anything new.  Basically I'm annoyed at having to unharf the end-of-cycle,
and I myself am perfectly satisfied that the Hat's conditions were
satisfied.  So I don't _want_ this verdict to stand, but I realize that I
may not have a leg to stand on concerning the Rules.

Is there any hope at all that Slakko won the Cycle, or should I stop
considering it Cycle 17?

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/ )
Current Album--Hunters & Collectors
Current Book--Barbara Smucker:Underground To Canada
How do I know anything really exists?  Kick it *really* hard.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 18:04:27 -0500 (EST)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Acka: Salaries

The following salaries were paid out at noon today:

Feb 02 12:00 EST: +35 A$ Alfvaen: salary - speaker 35
Feb 02 12:00 EST: +25 A$ breadbox: salary - promoter 25
Feb 02 12:00 EST: +25 A$ Alfvaen: salary - web-harfer 25
Feb 02 12:00 EST: +25 A$ breadbox: salary - tabulator 25
Feb 02 12:00 EST: +25 A$ rufus: salary - count tabula 25
Feb 02 12:00 EST: +25 A$ Alfvaen: salary - registrar 25
Feb 02 12:00 EST: +25 A$ Alfvaen: salary - scorekeeper 25
Feb 02 12:00 EST: +25 A$ Alfvaen: salary - financier 25
Feb 02 12:00 EST: +25 A$ Balsamic Dragon: salary - clerk of the court 25
Feb 02 12:00 EST: +25 A$ Vynd: salary - CSRR 25
Feb 02 12:00 EST: +25 A$ breadbox: salary - postmaster 25
Feb 02 12:00 EST: +25 A$ Slakko: salary - map-harfer 25
Feb 02 12:00 EST: +25 A$ Alfvaen: salary - undead-harfer 25
Feb 02 12:00 EST: +25 A$ Alfvaen: salary - trinket-harfer 25
Feb 02 12:00 EST: +1 autosculp The Gingham Wearer: salary - treasure-harfer
Feb 02 12:00 EST: +25 A$ Slakko: salary - chess-umpire 25
Feb 02 12:00 EST: +25 A$ breadbox: salary - rule-harfer 25

In addition, The Gingham Wearer paid 18 A$ for goose chow.

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/ )
Current Album--Hunters & Collectors
Current Book--Barbara Smucker:Underground To Canada
They've got more pseudonyms that I've got obsessive-compulsive disorders.  --vampyr

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 18:12:54 -0500 (EST)
From: "Gavin M. Doig" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Public Apology

First, let me apologise for my previous "apologies" which were not, in fact,
apologies. I hereby give myself a resounding slap with Rex's Golden Shovel
of Stupidity.
Second, let me apologise for my apology with one word per line. I thought it
was funny...
Next, I would like to apologise for being Annoying. Although I realised I
was being Annoying, I did not intend to be annoying.
I thought that, if my attempt to pay the org had not been enough to satisfy
the requirement of paying the standard harfer fee, the A$25 would have
automatically gone to the Treasury.
At least I didn't to something _really_ evil, like saying the earth was
flat. Now that would be a serious crime. And that must be at least 5 lines.

Rex Mundi.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 18:20:33 -0500 (EST)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Re: Acka: CFJ 523 (TRUE (upheld))

> Is there any hope at all that Slakko won the Cycle, or should I stop
> considering it Cycle 17?

(I meant, of course Cycle 18...but that's an unambiguous misspelling,
isn't it?)

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/ )
Current Album--Hunters & Collectors
Current Book--Barbara Smucker:Underground To Canada
While waxing parquet decks, Suez sailors vomit jauntily abaft.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 02 Feb 1998 18:25:17 -0500 (EST)
From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Um ... "Whoops"

On Mon, 2 Feb 1998, Brian Raiter wrote:

> It appears that we all overlooked the fact that Valaraukar was also a
> Blueprint, and in fact became one before ThinMan's Discovery was
> accepted. Thus it seems that, much to my chagrin, Proposal 2610 has in
> fact repealed Valaraukar's Blueprint instead. (It cannot even be
> construed as an unambiguous spelling error, since the proposal gave no
> indication of which rule it intended to repeal other than its number.)
> 
> Valaraukar became a Blueprint on January 18th at 20:41.
> The Circle became a Blueprint on January 24th at 08:56.
> Proposal 2610 was accepted on January 25th at 07:43.
> 
> Only the first action occurred more than two weeks ago (just barely),
> and I don't believe that the two-week pragmatism clause affects this
> situation. I mean, it cannot honestly be argued that everyone thought
> Valaraukar's Blueprint did not exist. Also, the rules pretty much
> exempt errors made solely by the Rule-Harfer from this effect (which
> is good, because otherwise I would have far too much power over the
> game).
> 
> I've gone back and reread the Blueprint rules, and I believe what I've
> stated here is correct. If I'm wrong, I would appreciate someone
> pointing out to me what I've missed. I would also welcome opinions as
> to the fate of Valaraukar the Gadget, as I'm not sure if it still
> exists or not, as the Blueprint was repealed instead of being
> Debunked. (Though it definitely does not have any of its questionable
> capabilities if it does exist ... so much for yesterday's party.)

The Frankenstein Monster rules override what normally happens to Gadgets
in the case of Frankenstein's Monsters.  It states that the Blueprint is
hidden away.  It makes no mention of the Blueprint ending up in the rules.
Besides, how can something be both hidden away and in the ruleset?  Unless
this becomes Blind Nomic.  Uh oh.

Yours,
Slakko
realising that could have been a really bad idea.
- -- 
Duncan C. "" Richer aka
Slakko the Really Lost Warner Brother - http://dcr24.quns.cam.ac.uk/
Queens' College -- PhD, Pure Maths, Graph Theory -- Cambridge University
Acka - RuneMaker, Chess-Umpire, Map-Harfer, Senator, Wearing Agenda Hat

------------------------------

End of ackanomic digest V3 #505
*******************************