Subject: ackanomic digest V2 #497
From: [email-masked] (ackanomic digest)
To: [email-masked]

ackanomic digest      Thursday, January 29 1998      Volume 02 : Number 497

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 21:22:53 -0800 (PST)
From: Brian Raiter <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: 153 (/dev/joe) (really this time!)

> I did consider this issue, though I neglected to write it up in my
> reasoning.  Thus I use my bronze torch to add the following paragraph
> of reasoning to CFCJ 153:

Sorry; Bronze Torch reasoning can only be provided before the results
of the CFJ are reported.

breadbox

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 22:34:28 -0700 (MST)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Re: acka:  Slakko's snowgod's disease hearing results

> Sorry, I have been slacking...

> 3 votes no, 6 votes yes...

Okay, so Red Barn is the Medical Examiner.  I encourage em to actually
post a treatment this time.  Make it a Silver Moon candidate or something.
:-)

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/ )
Current Album--Led Zeppelin II
Current Book--Gregory Benford:Timescape
Call on God, but row away from the rocks.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 22:20:58 -0700 (MST)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Re: Acka: Orgs

> > I leave SPAM
> > I request membership in Klingon

> It is my belief that Klingon has an open admissions policy. If this is the
> case then else...if is now a member of Klingon and so I suggest we withdraw
> our open admissions policy (having sufficient members for a unity vote) and
> then support this action. If we don't have an open admissions policy then I
> suggest that we allow else...if to join Klingon and then support this
> action.

Rex Mundi cancelled the open admissions policy before cancelling eir proxy
to Klingon and denouncing eir own expulsion of you.  So e must approve
else...if's admission as well.

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/ )
Current Album--Led Zeppelin II
Current Book--Gregory Benford:Timescape
Greenness disintegrates.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 21:42:47 -0700 (MST)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Acka: Crazy French-Scotsman

Slagothor has managed to earn the title of Crazy French-Scotsman, and
taken an early lead in Cycle 18.

Actually, by this point I'd almost rather see either a Crazy
French-Scotsman won without the retract-a-CFJ-or-proposal thing, or a
plain Crazy Scotsman.  (Hmmm...Agenda Hat idea...)

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/ )
Current Album--Led Zeppelin II
Current Book--Gregory Benford:Timescape
It's nothing permanent, just something from the Iron Age

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 22:14:48 -0700 (MST)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Acka: Big White Gazette

The Big White Gazette
"Wasting Bandwidth Longer Than Any Other Ackanomic Paper Still In Existence"

With the recent crisis in Ackanomic caused by Malenkai's
attempted(failed?) depature, the possible conflicts this may have created
with the Vulcan Coup's legacy of Rule 1, bringing about confusion as to
who held the offices of Speaker and Clerk of the Court, not to mention
Slakko's possibly controversial agenda-hat win, The Big White Gazette
is proud, as we enter into Ackanomic's second year, to bring to you,
in addition to this long run-on sentence...Magic Potato Stats!

Magic Potato Stats

The Magic Potato was created very early in the history of Ackanomic,
by Proposal 306(the seventh proposal ever submitted).  So it has also
been in existence for almost two years.  The Gazette's researchers, in
their slapdash investigation, only have data on the Potato's disposition
from the beginning of the Ackanomic digest list in May 1996.  (Though
the first few messages there indicate that the Potato may have been
neglected for a few weeks by that point.)  Still, from that period,
a few interesting facts about the Potato:

Niccolo Flychuck found the Potato the most times, a total of seven
times--July 8, 1996, November 8, 1996, January 20, 1997, May 5, 1997,
May 19, 1997, June 23, 1997, and September 22, 1997.  And, in the
possible thread where Malenkai remained Speaker after eir attempted
departure, e also found it on January 12, 1998, for a total of eight.
Runner-up is Malenkai emself, with a total of six times.

On the other hand, the current player who has gone the longest without
finding the Potato even once is Vynd, who has been a player since February
28, 1997, close to eleven months, and hasn't found it yet.

Four players have found the Potato twice in successive weeks: Mr. Lunatic
Fringe(then known as snowgod)found it October 21 and 28, 1996; AZTEC
GOD found it June 30 and July 7, 1997; Karma found it November 3 and
10, 1997; and Bill the pirate king found it January 19 and 26, 1998.
(Since the Great Tuba was not yet in existence in October 1996, Niccolo
Flychuck also attained the distinction of being the first player to hold
the Great Tuba two weeks in a row.)

ThinMan has found it the most frequently in a short period, three times
in five weeks from September 1 to 29, 1997(and since e did not find it
twice in a row from the above, you can figure out the dates).  Furthermore,
e also found it on August 4, for four times in two calendar months.

The longest period the Potato has gone without being found twice by the
same player is 13 weeks, from July 22 to October 14, 1996, when it was
found by Techno(now Crackfoo), Simon Marty Harriman, Brinjal, Wayne, 
snowgod(now Mr. Lunatic Fringe), Robin Hood, Pascal, this is not a name,
Malenkai, mr cwm, breadbox, Uncle Sam, and Bascule, before being found
by snowgod again.  There was a string of eleven unique finders from
February to May of 1997, but nothing longer than ten since.

The Gazette's researchers would have liked to also have stats on who
has held the Potato the greatest percentage of eir time in Acka, but
getting good information on the "lifespans" of all relevant players is
difficult, and time constraints force us to put out this article without
this information.  We apologize for the inconvenience.

Treasure Update

One of Alfvaen's treasures, the "your useless head" one, has been found
by Slakko, apparently entirely by accident.  "E had me convinced," claims
Alfvaen.  "I'd intended to be sure that you had not only created a
palindromic entity, but had done so specifically to find the treasure.
I'd forgotten about the Agenda Hat, and so when Slakko went out of eir
way to call it to my attention(as I'd done myself more than once while
treasure-hunting), I leapt to a conclusion.  Ah, well."

When pressed for treasure hints, Alfvaen said, "Obviously, any references
to '7/8' were hints for the 'useless head' treasure.  Look for hints
anywhere in BWG articles(I haven't put all of them on my web pages due
to lack of space, unfortunately), in trinket descriptions(one in
particular, that I can't say that I actually created), etc.  And it might
not hurt to have a browse through a codes and ciphers book or two.  I
recommend one called _Code Games_ by Norvin Pallas, although Andrew
Pennycook's _Codes And Ciphers_ is also worth a look."

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/ )
Current Album--Led Zeppelin II
Current Book--Gregory Benford:Timescape
"We can't let the fragments win!"  --ajflesch

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 08:31:46 +0200 (EET)
From: Uri Bruck <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: GAD.  GAD!  GAD?

I'm expressing disinterest in playing GAD.

Niccolo Flychuck

On Wed, 28 Jan 1998, AARON KEESLER wrote:

> All I was actually interested in was whether there was interest in
> playing... everyone who doesn't express disinterest in playing gets to
> play.  Isn't there a provision in the GAD rule that lets anyone make
> changes like the one you suggest?  By the way, I've submitted my
> amendment, but it's not going to work like I thought it would.  I'm
> going to retract it and fume, since I can't resubmit it :(
> 
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From:	John Frederic Mc Coy [SMTP:[email-masked]]
> >Sent:	Wednesday, January 28, 1998 1:58 PM
> >To:	[email-masked]
> >Subject:	Re: GAD.  GAD!  GAD?
> >
> >
> >
> >On Wed, 28 Jan 1998, The Gingham Wearer wrote:
> >
> >> > > I'm thinking about starting a good ol' game of Grab-A-Donkey when the
> >> > > thread splits and the CFJ blizzard die down.  Would anyone be
> >> interested
> >> > > in a game full of fun... and danger?
> >> > 
> >> > Count me in.
> >> > 
> >> > Robert Sevin,
> >> > Incognito Mosquito
> >> 
> >> Is it legal to play a subgame whilst on vacation?
> >> 
> >> 
> >> The Gingham Wearer.
> >> 
> >
> >No, it isn't.  Grab-A-Donkey is somewhat unusual, for a sub-game.  For one
> >thing, unless this is what Fortunato is attempting to amend, all active
> >non-vacationing players of Acka at the time the begining of a Game of
> >Grab-A-Donkey is announced are players in that game.  Whether they ask to
> >be or not.  So we don't really need all these messages saying that "I
> >wanna play" because believe me, you will regardless.  Robert Sevin did
> >quite well in the last game, as far as I can recall, surviving well into
> >the late rounds.
> >
> >                                 - Vynd, ex-Wrangler
> >
> >[email-masked]
> >
> >
> 
> ------------------------------
> 

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 00:41:34 -0600
From: Mitchell Harding <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Re: GAD.  GAD!  GAD?

>You were Rule 257'd around the beginning of January, along with Michael
>Wren and Calvin N Hobbes.  But CnH said e never saw a message asking em
>if e wanted to remain; did you?

I didn't see the message, but that doesn't mean I didn't receive it. 

>In any event, this makes my recent CFJ unnecessary, but I was concerned
>that you might end up being removed due to being On Ice for 60 days,
>and wouldn't be eligible for Elderhood, which would be a Crime.

Never fear, I shall never leave the game of Ackanomic if I can help it.

Robert Sevin

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 08:55:30 +0200 (EET)
From: Uri Bruck <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Oops.

It seemed to be in the right direction when I was singing it in four parts
this morning.

Niccolo Flychuck

On Wed, 28 Jan 1998, Duncan Richer wrote:

> Twas this a proper madrigal?
> I know not the correct form.
> 
> On Wed, 28 Jan 1998, AARON KEESLER wrote:
> 
> > As I look upon the world, I see
> > The faceless masses, huddled, lost.
> > It hits me: a jest, to cheer, delight.
> > No better yet, in fact - a game.
> > A game, of which the last I won.
> > I surf the web, I find the rule.
> etc. etc. in a jolly good style
> 
> - -- 
> Duncan C. "hate to say this, but you may still lose A$79" Richer aka
> Slakko the Really Lost Warner Brother - http://dcr24.quns.cam.ac.uk/
> Queens' College -- PhD, Pure Maths, Graph Theory -- Cambridge University
> Acka - RuneMaker, Chess-Umpire, Map-Harfer, Senator, Wearing Agenda Hat
> 
> ------------------------------
> 

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 09:17:47 +0200 (EET)
From: Uri Bruck <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: 153 (/dev/joe) (really this time!)

On Wed, 28 Jan 1998, Aaron V. Humphrey wrote:

> 
> > I think this should be judeged Invalid.
> > The date, as written is meaningless outside North America.
> 
> And if it had been written as 24/1/98, it would have been meaningless
> _in_ North America?

How about January 24 1998?

> 
> Frankly, I don't see the problem.  Something like 1/12/98 is ambiguous,
> but 1/24/98 isn't.  I'm used to seeing it both ways, I write if mm/dd/yy,
> and if it's ambiguous I'll write out the month-name because I can never
> remember if there's some differentiating punctuation(i.e. mm-dd-yy as
> opposed to dd/mm/yy), and I somehow doubt that many others know either.
> If the CFCJ was judged invalid for this reason, I would certainly appeal
> it.

I have no problem seeing both ways, and I guess most ackans, possibly all,
have no such problem either.
I know two standard date punctuation, / and . and neither is associated
specifically with any one ordering, AFAIK.

Niccolo Flychuck

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Jan 1998 23:26:06 -0800
From: Joshua Herreshoff <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: GAD.  GAD!  GAD?

I'd definitely be interested.

AARON KEESLER wrote:

> I'm thinking about starting a good ol' game of Grab-A-Donkey when the
> thread splits and the CFJ blizzard die down.  Would anyone be interested
> in a game full of fun... and danger?
>
> ------------------
> Aaron Keesler
> Lotus Notes Administrator
> Intranet Administrator
> Adtran, Inc.
> ------------------

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 09:27:59 +0200 (EET)
From: Uri Bruck <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: RFC

On Wed, 28 Jan 1998, Towsner wrote:

> >I have comments:
> >1. This proposal would make Parties and Churches become entities which are
> >not Organizations.
> >I think that's a bad idea.
> >I also think Corporations should be Organizations. Creating them as
> >non-Organizations is a bad idea, it would introduce an additional
> >structure into the game and would bring us back to the dark ages before
> >Political Parties were integrated into the Organizational framework (which
> >worked out quite well before the party concept was turned into an
> >Organizational Power).
> 	The whole point is to de-modularize the whole thing.  The problems
> came because the one structure tried to do too much.  This leaves that
> structure, replacing it with three.  While I admit it's more complicated,
> it's also more flexible.  Corporations have a different structure which, at
> least in my opinion, is more interesting.  Churches were never really
> organization except in name, and are spun off.  Political Parties are the
> only remaining kind of org, and rather then inherit all the org complexity,
> they only keep the minimum (for example there's no open admission policy.)
> Orgs which aren't any of these have no real power anyway, and can be
> handled informally.

No. You've got it backwards. Churches were the original real
organizations, and Parties were first de facto organizations and then
became proper organizations.
Creating a different complex structure is not a solution to any problem,
nor do I see any benefit in it. 
There are problems with the current structure, and I think your proposal
would do nothing towards solving those problems, but instead take several
parts out of it and create seperate structures. 
De-modularization would compromise Player Liberty, actions, and on another
note - you mentioned elsewhere that Cults are subsets of Churches, I don't
whether you intended it as a comment on their current status or on the
status they will have following your proposal - however currently this is
most definitely not so. Cults are a distinct type of Organization, which
have strong ties with Churches, but are not subsets of the above.

Niccolo Flychuck

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 07:49:20 +0000 ()
From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: The unambiguous message: This is hopefully my last shot (no chance)

On Wed, 28 Jan 1998, The Gingham Wearer wrote:

> Pardon? Oh, I take it that by responding I was acknowledging that I was
> giving you all my money in a way specified by your atrociously spent last
> message. Don't worry about it though; you've just given me all your
> tradable entities :-).

Gee, thanks for giving them back.

Right, if TGW somehow can't accept that I've won by now (if
not sooner), here's my super claim to Crackfoo (I hope you're listening)

There is _no such thing_ as an unambiguous spelling error.
Context is a matter of interpretation - you can't know what another player
means without being that other player.
Therefore it comes down to the possibility of a word being misspelled in a
particular way.

I can claim that "b" is a misspelling of "ruined", after all, that's only
6 errors - that could happen?  And because I've claimed it, if someone
else claims it another way the misspelling must be ambiguous, after all,
we can't agree!

As we have seen, any sequence of letters can be interpreted any way you
like.  So all spelling errors are ambiguous.  We must therefore look at
what the "correct" spelling of a word means.  Well, if a misspelled word
is ambiguous, its correct spelling is clearly itself.  The "correct
spelling of a misspelled word" is the way it was misspelled, not the way
you would want to correct it.  If it was spelled without the error, it
wouldn't be the misspelled word.  There's only one way to spell a word
when you specify how it is to be spelt.

I therefore claim that my letturc win is a win, because the word's meaning
is ambiguous, and letturc spelt correctly has 7 letters.  

So there. :-)

 -- 
Duncan C. "" Richer aka
Slakko the Really Lost Warner Brother - http://dcr24.quns.cam.ac.uk/
Queens' College -- PhD, Pure Maths, Graph Theory -- Cambridge University
Acka - RuneMaker, Chess-Umpire, Map-Harfer, Senator, Wearing Agenda Hat

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 08:04:07 +0000 ()
From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: The unambiguous message: This is hopefully my last shot (no chance)

On Thu, 29 Jan 1998, Duncan Richer wrote:

> I can claim that "b" is a misspelling of "ruined", after all, that's only
> 6 errors - that could happen?  And because I've claimed it, if someone
> else claims it another way the misspelling must be ambiguous, after all,
> we can't agree!

I would just like to additionally point out that, because of The Gingham
Wearer's argument, no Acka play has ever been unambiguous.  So if you
accept that argument, you crash the game because we can't understand what
we're saying (the tower of Babel argument, and with only one language!)

- -- 
Duncan C. "" Richer aka
Slakko the Really Lost Warner Brother - http://dcr24.quns.cam.ac.uk/
Queens' College -- PhD, Pure Maths, Graph Theory -- Cambridge University
Acka - RuneMaker, Chess-Umpire, Map-Harfer, Senator, Wearing Agenda Hat

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 01:20:07 -0800 (PST)
From: Brian Raiter <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Big White Gazette

> The Big White Gazette
> "Wasting Bandwidth Longer Than Any Other Ackanomic Paper Still In Existence"

And a fine waste of bandwidth it is!

> Magic Potato Stats

I enjoyed this bit of Acka-trivia.

> The Gazette's researchers would have liked to also have stats on who
> has held the Potato the greatest percentage of eir time in Acka, but
> getting good information on the "lifespans" of all relevant players
> is difficult, and time constraints force us to put out this article
> without this information.  We apologize for the inconvenience.

If you would like, I can get this info to you. (Or, to be exact, the
best info available.) I've had need to collect it myself.

> I recommend one called _Code Games_ by Norvin Pallas, although
> Andrew Pennycook's _Codes And Ciphers_ is also worth a look.

I read both of those books *so* many times as a kid! Code Games was
especially fun.

breadbox

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 01:28:47 -0800 (PST)
From: Brian Raiter <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Timestamp change

Unless there are serious objections, I will be installing the new
timestamping program on all of the public mailing lists on February
first.

breadbox
Postmaster

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 08:17:15 -0500
From: [email-masked] (John Bollinger)
Subject: Re: Acka: Proposal 2611 accepted

>I suggest Rule 1 is repealed. #1 pay the standard harfer fee (that is, pay
>that amount to the treasury, not pay that Malenkai's-loophole-attempt org)
>and change its name to the following double-quote delimited string: "Vulcan" .
>I approve this suggestion.

I apologize for my tardiness and approve of this suggestion.

ThinMan

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 08:42:07 -0500
From: [email-masked] (John Bollinger)
Subject: Acka: Proxy

I have had little time for Ackanomic lately, and I believe my party is
being unduly inconvenienced by it.  Therefore I proxy my support to the
political party of which I am a member, currently named either Vulcan or
Rule 1 is repealed. #1.

ThinMan

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 08:46:34 -0500
From: "Vivian Norwood" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Subject Lines

> Also for interest's sake, how many messages related to GAD, responses
> to proposals, acceptance of CFJs, etc, were posted on the wrong list?
> 
> If people are not going to post stuff to the proper lists so that
> those of us who don'w want all the extra mail don't get it, then I
> suggest abolishing the postal code.  What is the point?  I am getting
> 90 messages a day from Acka alone, and am *only* subscribed to
> ackanomic and acka-voting.  
> 
> I don't see why it is a big deal to respond to CFJs privately.  The
> counterargument is vacuous; the only thing I can conclude from it
> is that we should vote on proposals publically also.

I have no problem with people responding to CFJs privately, and if that is
what people want, that is what they will do.  However, a public response is
still perfectly allowable within the rules and certainly not a symptom of
snow god's disease (such as a public proposal vote would be).  Given that
some people want CFJs to be accepted publically, which list to you think is
most appropriate for those messages?  I certainly don't think acka-research
applies, and acka-games, finance, voting all seem to be out too.

Balsamic Dragon

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 08:00:31 -0600
From: AARON KEESLER <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Actions.

Ok, I made two sincere (even though the haiku was bad, sorry about that)
attempts to post while Hosed, and since I have no money left, I'm going
to pull a 'Slakko' and just not worry about it.  Heck, I only have A$24
anyway.

So, I accept the trinket from Alfvaen, admiring its elegant lines :)

I retract Proposal 2669.

And, I apologize to everyone, especially Malenkai and breadbox, for
spamming the main list.

- ------------------
Aaron Keesler
Lotus Notes Administrator
Intranet Administrator
Adtran, Inc.
- ------------------

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 16:48:17 +0000 ()
From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Actions.

On Thu, 29 Jan 1998, AARON KEESLER wrote:

> Ok, I made two sincere (even though the haiku was bad, sorry about that)
> attempts to post while Hosed, and since I have no money left, I'm going
> to pull a 'Slakko' and just not worry about it.  Heck, I only have A$24
> anyway.

I've been eponymed!  Wow!
- -- 
Duncan C. "" Richer aka
Slakko the Really Lost Warner Brother - http://dcr24.quns.cam.ac.uk/
Queens' College -- PhD, Pure Maths, Graph Theory -- Cambridge University
Acka - RuneMaker, Chess-Umpire, Map-Harfer, Senator, Wearing Agenda Hat

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:01:00 +0000 ()
From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: ** Illuminatus Notice

If I won the cycle when current game documents seem to indicate, then the
Illuminatus should be calling for Agenda Conditions real soon now.

Yours,
Slakko
the guy with a great idea for a new Agenda Condition.
- -- 
Duncan C. "" Richer aka
Slakko the Really Lost Warner Brother - http://dcr24.quns.cam.ac.uk/
Queens' College -- PhD, Pure Maths, Graph Theory -- Cambridge University
Acka - RuneMaker, Chess-Umpire, Map-Harfer, Senator, Wearing Agenda Hat

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 17:44:09 -0000
From: "The Gingham Wearer" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: The unambiguous message: This is hopefully my last shot (no chance)

> Right, if TGW somehow can't accept that I've won by now (if
> not sooner), here's my super claim to Crackfoo (I hope you're listening)
> 
> There is _no such thing_ as an unambiguous spelling error.
> Context is a matter of interpretation - you can't know what another
player
> means without being that other player.
> Therefore it comes down to the possibility of a word being misspelled in
a
> particular way.
> 
> I can claim that "b" is a misspelling of "ruined", after all, that's only
> 6 errors - that could happen?  And because I've claimed it, if someone
> else claims it another way the misspelling must be ambiguous, after all,
> we can't agree!
> 
> As we have seen, any sequence of letters can be interpreted any way you
> like.  So all spelling errors are ambiguous.  We must therefore look at
> what the "correct" spelling of a word means.  Well, if a misspelled word
> is ambiguous, its correct spelling is clearly itself.  The "correct
> spelling of a misspelled word" is the way it was misspelled, not the way
> you would want to correct it.  If it was spelled without the error, it
> wouldn't be the misspelled word.  There's only one way to spell a word
> when you specify how it is to be spelt.
> 
> I therefore claim that my letturc win is a win, because the word's
meaning
> is ambiguous, and letturc spelt correctly has 7 letters.  
> 
> So there. :-)

But letturc isn't a word. It is a sequence of random letters.

The Gingham Wearer.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 11:17:05 -0700 (MST)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Re: Acka: Proxy

> I have had little time for Ackanomic lately, and I believe my party is
> being unduly inconvenienced by it.  Therefore I proxy my support to the
> political party of which I am a member, currently named either Vulcan or
> Rule 1 is repealed. #1.

Interesting.  I'm not sure if Malenkai has tendered eir approval yet, but
ThinMan has now approved both the name change to Vulcan and the transfer
of the trinket "Vulcan" to emself...

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/ )
Current Album--Cock Robin:First Love/Last Rites
Current Book--Gregory Benford:Timescape
Inigo, I am your father--prepare to join the Dark Side.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 11:20:13 -0700 (MST)
From: [email-masked] (Aaron V. Humphrey)
Subject: Re: Acka: Actions.

> Ok, I made two sincere (even though the haiku was bad, sorry about that)
> attempts to post while Hosed, and since I have no money left, I'm going
> to pull a 'Slakko' and just not worry about it.  Heck, I only have A$24
> anyway.

And, luckily, none of the organizations you belong to has more than A$79
either, SPAM having been drained already by Slakko, the Church of
Azpiazu wisely not retaining such assets, the Aaronic League not being
that type of Org, and The Moral Kiosk having already spent its money.

> So, I accept the trinket from Alfvaen, admiring its elegant lines :)

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/ )
Current Album--Cock Robin:First Love/Last Rites
Current Book--Gregory Benford:Timescape
Oh my God, I'm an alien on Star Trek!...wait, no, just a bad hair day.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 22:57:35 -0800
From: **Alexandre Muniz <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Illumination

Well, it's (probably) that time again, please reply with your Agenda
conditions. Depending on which of Slakko's messages caused the win, The
Gingham Wearer may or may not own the hat which e had been wearing, and
K 2 definitely still owns the hat e was wearing (And if I missed anyone,
you know what you're wearing.) Please submit (3 - the number of agenda
hats you own) agenda conditions. This time I will use my silly hat
powers for any condition which appears essentially impossible to
acheive, or particularly ambiguous, so beware. I will also be submitting
a fix tonight for what I believe to be bugs in the bidding process,
hopefully it will pass before I have to start the bidding.

**two-star

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 14:13:33 -0500 (EST)
From: John Frederic Mc Coy <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Proxy

On Thu, 29 Jan 1998, Aaron V. Humphrey wrote:

> 
> > I have had little time for Ackanomic lately, and I believe my party is
> > being unduly inconvenienced by it.  Therefore I proxy my support to the
> > political party of which I am a member, currently named either Vulcan or
> > Rule 1 is repealed. #1.
> 
> Interesting.  I'm not sure if Malenkai has tendered eir approval yet, but
> ThinMan has now approved both the name change to Vulcan and the transfer
> of the trinket "Vulcan" to emself...
> 

To my knowledge Malenkai has approved of neither.  It might be best, at
this point, if he were to approve of the transfer and denounce the name
change, since ThinMan seems to be busy and might not be able destroy it in
time.

                               - Vynd

[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 19:18:17 -0000
From: "Gavin M. Doig" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Orgs

>then support this action. If we don't have an open admissions policy then I
>suggest that we allow else...if to join Klingon and then support this
>action.
>
We don't have an open admissions policy. I cancelled it when I was the only
member. ;-)

I support else...if's admission to Klingon.

Rex Mundi.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 19:42:56 +0000 ()
From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Subject Lines

On Wed, 28 Jan 1998, Malenkai wrote:

> Also for interest's sake, how many messages related to GAD, responses
> to proposals, acceptance of CFJs, etc, were posted on the wrong list?
> 
> If people are not going to post stuff to the proper lists so that
> those of us who don'w want all the extra mail don't get it, then I
> suggest abolishing the postal code.  What is the point?  I am getting
> 90 messages a day from Acka alone, and am *only* subscribed to
> ackanomic and acka-voting.  
> 
> I don't see why it is a big deal to respond to CFJs privately.  The
> counterargument is vacuous; the only thing I can conclude from it
> is that we should vote on proposals publically also.

Agora's tried that - it makes things interesting.  But CFJ responses
aren't subject to strategic behaviour. 

> 
> I don't see why it is a big deal to discuss GAD and other games on
> acka-games.

Other games, games and contest games, fair enough.  But GAD is, by
definition, played by all active Ackans, regardless of their subscription
to acka-games or whatever.  It is therefore not quite as inappropriate to
talk about GAD on the main list as it is to talk about other subgames.

> I don't see why it is a big deal to respond to proposals on acka-research.
> Your opinion of the proposal is not more important than others who
> have chose to respond on acka-research, or so important that those 
> not on acka-research need to see it too.
Fair enough.  I've been transferring stuff to research when I've seen fit
to.
- -- 
Duncan C. "" Richer aka
Slakko the Really Lost Warner Brother - http://dcr24.quns.cam.ac.uk/
Queens' College -- PhD, Pure Maths, Graph Theory -- Cambridge University
Acka - RuneMaker, Chess-Umpire, Map-Harfer, Senator, Wearing Agenda Hat

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 19:53:40 +0000 ()
From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: The unambiguous message: This is hopefully my last shot (no chance)

On Thu, 29 Jan 1998, The Gingham Wearer wrote:

> But letturc isn't a word. It is a sequence of random letters.

Definition of spell:

1. To form words with letters, esp. with the proper letters, either orally
or in writing. 

I claim that letturc, whenever I have said it, is a spelling of either
lettuce or letters.  There is no requirement that spelling be correct in
the definition of spelling.

Definition of word:

a constituent part of a sentence

Definition of sentence:

A combination of words which is complete as expressing a thought, and in
writing is marked at the close by a period, or full point.

So here we go.  I claim that my use of the text "letturc letturc letturc
letturc letturc letturc letturc letturc letturc letturc" in this sentence,
each instance of the text "letturc" as it occurs within this paragraph
meaning either lettuce or letters but not both, is a blatant attempt to
win.  Each of the instances of the word "letturc" is a word, because it is
included as part of a sentence.  All of them are spelt, but not spelt
correctly, however, the correct spelling is unsure because each word could
be lettuce or letters, but it is impossible to determine which because my
intent is to leave it impossible to determine.  As a result, there are at
least 10 words in this message, all of which happen to be "letturc", which
are misspelled, but not unambiguously misspelled, and hence they do not
fall victim to being "treated" as ordinary words under Rule 340.
Therefore, in the event that I have not already won a Cycle of Ackanomic,
this event sets my Agenda Hat Condition to True and I have won a Cycle of
Ackanomic.

- -- 
Duncan C. "" Richer aka
Slakko the Really Lost Warner Brother - http://dcr24.quns.cam.ac.uk/
Queens' College -- PhD, Pure Maths, Graph Theory -- Cambridge University
Acka - RuneMaker, Chess-Umpire, Map-Harfer, Senator, Wearing Agenda Hat

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 10:14:42 -1000
From: Rico <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Crazy French-Scotsman

On Wed, 28 Jan 1998, Aaron V. Humphrey wrote:

> Actually, by this point I'd almost rather see either a Crazy
> French-Scotsman won without the retract-a-CFJ-or-proposal thing, or a
> plain Crazy Scotsman.  (Hmmm...Agenda Hat idea...)

So I'm unoriginal.  So convict me.  (About the simple Scotsman thing, I
submitted the retraction as close to the time I submitted the first
complaint, but on the following day.  Just testing my computer clock to
see which title I gained.  The clock would appear to be fast, or else my
memory's going, or else my memory's going.  (See how unoriginal I am?  I
just ripped off the Gingham Wearer after apologizing for being
unoriginal))

Actually, I did have an original idea, but Slakko's win, and the
resultant opportunity to jump out in front of Cycle 18, forced (or,
rather, persuaded) me to abandon it.  I've never been able to resist the
lure of material wealth and prestige over simple pride in my own work.
I'm kind of a slut that way.

- -rico, who is wondering why his newly created random .sig generator has a
preference for certain taglines.  Perhaps it's his computer clock.

There are three kinds of people: those who can count and those who can't. 

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 11:05:29 -1000
From: Rico <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: my recent complaints

I would like to apologize to anyone I may have offended or otherwise
annoyed with my recent Rule 1129 binge.  I finally got the prescription
refilled, and doctors say the homicidal tendencies, irritability, and
predisposition to voting Vulcan should be gone any day now.  In the
meantime, I extend humble apologies to any and all Ackanomic players I
may have affronted, but specifically the following beings:

Alfvaen, the Scorekeeper, for making em deal with yet *another* frivolous
end-of-cycle score change.  Or several.

Balsamic Dragon, the Clerk of the Courts, for putting em in the position
of having to harf my petty and annoying CFJ submission-retraction.

else...if, for taking, if involuntarily, eir points.

Any out there who may have pointy hair, for calling em fools.

The members of the organization formerly known as Vulcan, for the second
sentence of this e-mail.

Any whose medieval sensitivities I may have offended by insinuating that
the earth was anything other than <insert your personal belief here>.

The beings to whom the last sentence pertains, for insinuating that eir
sensibilities are medieval.

The Postmaster, for wasting Bandwidth with this message.

- -rico

Very funny, Scotty. Now beam down my clothes. 

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 19:34:48 -0000
From: "The Gingham Wearer" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Proxy

> > > I have had little time for Ackanomic lately, and I believe my party
is
> > > being unduly inconvenienced by it.  Therefore I proxy my support to
the
> > > political party of which I am a member, currently named either Vulcan
or
> > > Rule 1 is repealed. #1.
> > 
> > Interesting.  I'm not sure if Malenkai has tendered eir approval yet,
but
> > ThinMan has now approved both the name change to Vulcan and the
transfer
> > of the trinket "Vulcan" to emself...
> > 
> 
> To my knowledge Malenkai has approved of neither.  It might be best, at
> this point, if he were to approve of the transfer and denounce the name
> change, since ThinMan seems to be busy and might not be able destroy it
in
> time.

Malenkai has his approval proxied IIRC. I believe that both actions have
now been approved by all members of Rule 1 is repealed. #1. If this is the
case then I'm pretty sure that the transfer happens and the name change
doesn't. What I don't know, however is whether Vulcan will have to pay the
standard harfer fee.

The Gingham Wearer.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 19:40:10 -0000
From: "The Gingham Wearer" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Illumination

If it is the case that I currently own one agenda hat then I trade it to
the mad hatters in return for A$1. I believe this will allow me to submit
three agenda conditions.

The Gingham Wearer.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 16:42:13 -0500
From: "Vivian Norwood" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: CFJ 513 appeal

Correct me if I'm wrong, but CFJ 513 was appealed on January 21, 1998 and
it has been over a week since then . . . 

Balsamic Dragon
Clerk of the Courts

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 21:45:21 +0000 ()
From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: my recent complaints

On Thu, 29 Jan 1998, Rico wrote:

> Any out there who may have pointy hair, for calling em fools.

Never apologise to the pointy haired fools

O- O/ O- O\ O-

Yours,
Slakko
- -- 
Duncan C. "" Richer aka
Slakko the Really Lost Warner Brother - http://dcr24.quns.cam.ac.uk/
Queens' College -- PhD, Pure Maths, Graph Theory -- Cambridge University
Acka - RuneMaker, Chess-Umpire, Map-Harfer, Senator, Wearing Agenda Hat

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 29 Jan 1998 16:46:22 -0500
From: "Vivian Norwood" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: CFCJ 149 (FALSE)

Clerk of the Courts
- -----------------------------------------------------------------------
Call For Criminal Judgement 149 - January 23, 1998
Subject: no one else gets the boot
Initiator: else..if
Judge: Bill the pirate king (selected January 23, 1998, 3:35 p.m.)
Judgement: FALSE

Statement: 

Vynd has commited a crime

Initiators Reasoning:

	Vynd announced that he was ejecting The Gingham Wearer (then known
as no one else) from Vulcan headquarters.  However according to Rule 1,
while an Evil Overlord of Ackanomic (retired) may eject a member of Vulcan
from Vulcan headquarters, Vulcan must eject a non-member from the
headquarters.  The only reasonable interpretation of this is that it is an
organizational action.  Therefore Vynd is not permitted to eject any one
not in Vulcan from Vulcan Headquarters.

Suggested Penalty:

	Since this was an honest mistake, I'd be inclined to recommend a
lessened penalty, however I feel some token penalty is still appropriate.
I suggest an apology of 5 lines.

Judges Reasoning:

After examining the evidence(or lack thereof) I must rule this cfcj FALSE.

I looked for something about this in the archives but I couldn't find
anything 
saying that vynd was flinging TGW.   Neither the accused nor the person
allegedly ejected can remember exact details.  I recall a cfj stating that
though a 
player could change his name to a string found elsewhere in the rules it
did not 
mean his name was reffered to by the rules so in my opinion the player
known 
as no other player was not even really allowed into vulcan HQ so he could't

have been ejected by vynd or thin man or whoever supposedly did it.

------------------------------

End of ackanomic digest V2 #497
*******************************