Subject: ackanomic digest V2 #489
From: [email-masked] (ackanomic digest)
To: [email-masked]

ackanomic digest       Monday, January 26 1998       Volume 02 : Number 489

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 00:04:46 -0500 (EST)
From: John Frederic Mc Coy <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Very Long Land RFC

This started out as a simple proposal to remove Senate approval for land
purchases.  Along the way, I decided to try and give Acka not just
locations and a map, but actual geography.  My biggest stumbling block has
been how to interface all of this with the map and the map-harfer, which I
believe would have to become a more important office.  At the very least
the "Null Map" would no longer be an option.  In any event, here is what I
propose to do, with some additional comments.  Sorry it is so long (really
sorry) but it proved remarkably difficult to achieve this, there are a lot
of rules that need patching to make it work.  I also took the opportunity
to change a few of the more loosely written rules on related subjects.

RFC: Geography

Renumber Rule 835 Locations to 801.

Create a new Rule 810, titled Land, with the following BLAH delimited
text.

BLAH

Kaas of Land are tradeable entities.  A Kaa of Land is one Kaa in size.
Kaas of Land are all seperate Locations.  Kaas of Land are Common
Locations unless specified otherwise.  

Kaas of Land have positions relative to each other.  They are sqaure
in shape, and arranged in a grid pattern.  Thus every Kaa is bordered
on all 4 sides by another Kaa of land, or by another Location
specified by the Rules.  Kaas of Land cannot be moved in relation to each
other.  If it is ever the case that the position of a Location mentioned
by the rules is indeterminate, the Map-Harfer shall assign it a position
no more than 3 Kaas away from an owned Kaa of Land, unless the Location in
question is unmappable.  All the owned Land in Ackanomic is surounded by
the Wilds of Ackanomic.  The Wilds of Ackanomic begin at a distance of 3
Kaas (unowned of course) from any owned Kaa of Land.

{{[This gives us the essentials of a geography, fixing land in place and
giving it definite position relative to each other.  One thing it lacks is
compass-directions, another, a way of interfacing the existing map with
these new requirements (really part of the same problem).  It is also
the first attempt to define Land in one rule.]}}

BLAH

Create a new Rule numbered 811, with the title Real Estate, with the
following $$$ delimited text.

$$$
A player may purchase an empty, unowned Kaa of land for A$50.  He must 
specify the position of this Kaa relative to some currently owned Kaa of
Land which is no more than 3 Kaas away, or the purchase will fail.  

A player may purchase an unowned Kaa of land with a building on it only if
that building is not mentioned in the Rules.  The cost of this land is
A$50 plus half the cost of the building (including the cost of any towers)
on that land. If purchasing a Kaa of land would cause the building on it
to be destroyed, then the player must instead pay A$50 plus the cost of
the destruction of the building to purchase the Kaa.
$$$

{{[This essentially replaces the Land Baroncy rule.  It eliminates Senate
approval of purchases, something I never saw any reason for.  It does
include a number of restrictions, most importantly one preventing people
from buying things like the Senate or the Hall of Elders.]}}

Amend Rule 839 Buildings by applying the following ARGH delimited changes.

ARGH
Renumber the Rule to 820.

Replace "A building is a class of entity in Ackanomic which can be of six
sizes:" with "Buildings are a class of entities, they are also locations.
When created, each building requires a number of Kaas which are not
occupied by another building (empty), and are contiguous, on which the
building is placed.  The number of Kaas depends on the size of the
building.  There are 6 possible sizes for buildings, listed below along
with the number of Kaas of space they take up:"

Delete the last sentence from the paragraph begining with: The Senate

{{[now part of a new rule]}}

Add the following text to the end of paragraph begining with "A player may
change the name":  A player may post a description of a building he owns
at any time.  This then becomes the description of that building, provided
that the description is in accordance with the Rules.

{{[This doesn't really change anything, but it does consolidate to some
extent the Rules on buildings.  The next set of changes sets up a Rule
dealing with building purchases.  I think the prices should probably be
changed, but I'll leave that for another time.]}}

ARGH

Renumber Rule 846 Constructions and Architectual Aesthetic to 821, and
make the following GRANDE delimited changes to its text.

GRANDE
Delete the last three paragraphs and replace them with the following text:

When purchasing a new building, a player must unambiguously specify a Kaa
or Kaas of land on which the building will be placed.  He must also
specify the size of the building and pay the construction cost for a
building of said size.  Construction of a building is only successful if
the player purchasing the building specifies sufficient contiguous, empty
land, owned by himself, for the new building to fit. If he does not,
construction fails, and his A$ is returned.  if it succeeds, the building
is created in the specified location, owned by the purchasing player.

If a building is destroyed, it and any towers attached to it no longer
exist. If a building is damaged, it can be repaired by paying the
rebuilding cost.  For the cost of an upgrade, a player may increase the
size of a building he owns to the next largest size, provided that he owns
a sufficient number of empty Kaas of land that are contiguous to the
current location of the building. Extravagant buildings cannot be
upgraded.  No player may destroy, rebuild, or upgrade a building he does
not own.

GRANDE

Amend Rule 841 Towers by deleting the last sentence of section 3) and
replacing it with the following REALTALL delimited text:

REALTALL
Towers that are added to buildings are considered to be attached to those
buildings.  A tower may only be attached to one building.  Towers are
always owned by the owner of the land on which they are built, or the
owner of the building to which they are attached.  Towers cannot be
removed from buildings to which they are attached, or be attached to a
building after they have been built.
REALTALL

Amend Rule 841 by adding the following PARROT delimited text to the end
of section 6):

PARROT
A stand-alone tower's size is small if it is less than 70 meters in
height, cosy if it is 140 to 559 meters in height, classy if it is 560 or
more meters in height.  Regardless of their size, stand-alone towers
require only 1 Kaa of land.  Towers attached to buildings do not effect
the size of the building in any way.
PARROT

{{[these two changes give towers a little more "connected-ness" with
buildings, and better defines free-standing towers.]}}

Repeal Rule 844 Land Baroncy {{[My original goal.]}}

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 12:52:45 -1100
From: K 2 <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka:Orgs

> (I believe he's accepted into all except shell#10)
>

Not shell#10? Is there something wrong with me? < sniffs armpit > < applies
deodorant >

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 13:22:45 -1100
From: K 2 <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Expert in non-CFJs

Oh well, it was worth a try. Since I get no credit for these CFJs, nor any
lasting record of them....

I am creating a trinket called CFJ 484(A), worth $A 1, described by :
"To the casual viewer, it is a blank sheet of paper. To the more discerning
viewer there are indentations as though something had been written but then
rubbed out afterward."
I am creating a trinket called CFJ 513(M), worth $A 1, described by :
"To the casual viewer, it is a blank sheet of paper. To the more discerning
viewer there are indentations as though something had been written but then
cruelly rubbed out afterward. Scientific testing would reveal the entire text
of CFJ 513 as it never existed."
I am creating a trinket called CFJ 514(M), worth $A 1, described by :
"To the casual viewer, it is a blank sheet of paper. To the more discerning
viewer there are indentations as though something had been written but then
cruelly rubbed out afterward. Scientific testing would reveal the entire text
of CFJ 514 as it never existed."

I gift CFJ 484(A), CFJ 513(M), CFJ 514(M) as active service medals in a
reality that never existed.

I accept CFJ 484(A), CFJ 513(M), CFJ 514(M) and pin them to my chest.

> I vote against this application for expertise, on the basis that non-CFJ's
> is not an area of the rules. Don't feel too bad, K2, I realize some of the
> things we've given out expert status in before also aren't areas of the
> rules, but in this particular case I also feel that a string of bad luck
> (random assignments, as opposed to anything you actively did) is no basis
> for expert status.
>
> BTW, I have no idea who the other senators are now, so please speak up
> if you are a senator. :-)
>
> /dev/joe
> Senator

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 13:11:06 -1100
From: K 2 <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Two questions

> But this brings me to my second question. How would people feel about
> changing the Ackanomic time from EST/EDT to GMT?

Sure GMT, why not?

Of course Hawaii would be easier (until I can find why the @#$@$% my
e-mail thingy thinks i'm in the -10 zone :)

>

>

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 22:44:17 -0800
From: **Alexandre Muniz <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Very Long Land RFC

John Frederic Mc Coy wrote:

> Kaas of Land have positions relative to each other.  They are sqaure
> in shape, and arranged in a grid pattern.

Really, they should be rhombi arranged in a quasiperiodic tiling. But
I'll forgive you. If we make it cartesian, however, we may as well
formalize the numbering system to specify kaas by. Something special
should be at (0,0). The Greenwich observatory? The Tower of Bandwidth?
The Map-Harfers house?

> Create a new Rule numbered 811, with the title Real Estate, with the
> following $$$ delimited text.
> 
> $$$
> A player may purchase an empty, unowned Kaa of land for A$50.  He must
> specify the position of this Kaa relative to some currently owned Kaa of
> Land which is no more than 3 Kaas away, or the purchase will fail.
> 
> A player may purchase an unowned Kaa of land with a building on it only if
> that building is not mentioned in the Rules.  The cost of this land is
> A$50 plus half the cost of the building (including the cost of any towers)
> on that land. If purchasing a Kaa of land would cause the building on it
> to be destroyed, then the player must instead pay A$50 plus the cost of
> the destruction of the building to purchase the Kaa.
> $$$

No player may buy more than one kaa of land per month from the treasury.
On the first day of each month, any empty unowned kaa of land
horizontally, vertically, or diagonally adjacent to three kaas of land
owned by the same player becomes owned by that player and any owned kaa
of land not containing a building that is not horizontally, vertically,
or diagonally adjacent to two or three owned kaas of land becomes
unowned. These events occur simutaneously.

Generally, I like the idea of formalizing the map, but I think that the
map harfer should have broad powers to rearrange things, at least when
there are no objections.

**two-star

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 06:53:25 +0000 ()
From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: A look at ex-Rule 1

On Sun, 25 Jan 1998, Brian Raiter wrote:

> > Given that we can't be sure it is gone though, I am asking all those who
> > supported my earlier attempts to restrict it to vote YES on Proposal 2637.
> > We can't afford a single anti-vote, as I'm sure Vulcan are massing all
> > their Bonus Votes and Tammany Bribes for an assault on it to protect eir
> > fragile position.
> 
> Yeah, like they've ever successfully blocked a single kill-rule-1-dead
> proposal in the past.

Before they got their act together they did just that on two occasions.
Slowed me right down, it did.

> 
> There have been some very interesting and nomicky assaults on Rule 1,
> but it would be nice if you folks could be a little more civil about
> it. I know nobody asked me, but I would like to throw out a few
> opinions:
> 
> One attack at a time. Avoid multiplying thread splits for their own
> sake. Three simultaneous threads is enough to keep just about anybody
> busy. Certainly me.
> 
> Clean up after yourselves! Minimize the danger of unforeseen side
> effects. If you're going to add these weird clauses to the rules, have
> them automatically delete themselves if Rule 1 currently does not
> exist.
> 
> Finally, there is nothing wrong with Rule 1 besides its location. I
> don't like having more than one Rule being above Rule 102. But I have
> no problem with anything else about it. If you have a serious, honest
> gripe with the Gold Pocketwatches or something, then okay. But if, as
> I strongly suspect, you're all just shooting at it because "it's
> there", then be a little more civilized. Just renumber it to be below
> Rule 102, and its danger of unforeseen side effects becomes close to
> nil. You probably wouldn't even need to remove the last paragraph. But
> at the very least, preserve it in square brackets.

I never wanted it deleted myself.  I just want its precedence clauses
removed (draw out the teeth) so that it can be safely stored in the
ruleset higher on.  If it turns out that Rule 1 was repealed, then I'll
reinstate all but the last paragraph as a new rule anyway in a later
proposal.

Besides, my game state thing fixes up the question over whether or not the
rules themselves are part of the game state, something which is ambiguous
currently.

> (By the way, if you do try to renumber it, put it in the 1100s, the
> harf section, because it is a very harfy thing. Please don't put it in
> its own section.)
Fine.

- -- 
Duncan C. "" Richer aka
Slakko the Really Lost Warner Brother - http://dcr24.quns.cam.ac.uk/
Queens' College -- PhD, Pure Maths, Graph Theory -- Cambridge University
Ackanomic - RuneMaker - Chess-Umpire - Map-Harfer - Senator - Swinger

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 07:01:51 +0000 ()
From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Very Long Land RFC

On Sun, 25 Jan 1998, **Alexandre Muniz wrote:

> John Frederic Mc Coy wrote:
> 
> > Kaas of Land have positions relative to each other.  They are sqaure
> > in shape, and arranged in a grid pattern.
> 
> Really, they should be rhombi arranged in a quasiperiodic tiling. But
> I'll forgive you. If we make it cartesian, however, we may as well
> formalize the numbering system to specify kaas by. Something special
> should be at (0,0). The Greenwich observatory? The Tower of Bandwidth?
> The Map-Harfers house?

No, we're a city.  It should be the Ackan General Post Office (or failing
that breadbox's house as Postmaster).

Just don't make me shake the map too hard.  Please?
Personally I think the chessboard numbering scheme is perfectly adequate
if we can fit it in with existing rules.

I would also like to point out that Oceans and Beaches is going to
completely screw up the attempt to fix the land situation if it passes, so
I suggest waiting until its voting results are known before proceeding
further.

> 
> > Create a new Rule numbered 811, with the title Real Estate, with the
> > following $$$ delimited text.
> > 
> > $$$
> > A player may purchase an empty, unowned Kaa of land for A$50.  He must
> > specify the position of this Kaa relative to some currently owned Kaa of
> > Land which is no more than 3 Kaas away, or the purchase will fail.
> > 
> > A player may purchase an unowned Kaa of land with a building on it only if
> > that building is not mentioned in the Rules.  The cost of this land is
> > A$50 plus half the cost of the building (including the cost of any towers)
> > on that land. If purchasing a Kaa of land would cause the building on it
> > to be destroyed, then the player must instead pay A$50 plus the cost of
> > the destruction of the building to purchase the Kaa.
> > $$$
> 
> No player may buy more than one kaa of land per month from the treasury.
> On the first day of each month, any empty unowned kaa of land
> horizontally, vertically, or diagonally adjacent to three kaas of land
> owned by the same player becomes owned by that player and any owned kaa
> of land not containing a building that is not horizontally, vertically,
> or diagonally adjacent to two or three owned kaas of land becomes
> unowned. These events occur simutaneously.

But does a building become unowned if it is surrounded by 4 or more other
buildings? :-)  You know /dev/joe's going to run riot with this.

> 
> Generally, I like the idea of formalizing the map, but I think that the
> map harfer should have broad powers to rearrange things, at least when
> there are no objections.

Give em the right to issue an MSR (Mapping Sense Report) to alter the map
locations of buildings, provided their new locations are in accordance
with the rules.  Under the same CSR restrictions this should be fairly
foolproof.

- -- 
Duncan C. "" Richer aka
Slakko the Really Lost Warner Brother - http://dcr24.quns.cam.ac.uk/
Queens' College -- PhD, Pure Maths, Graph Theory -- Cambridge University
Ackanomic - RuneMaker - Chess-Umpire - Map-Harfer - Senator - Swinger

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 07:23:47 +0000 ()
From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: More Thoughts on Rule 1

On the noun phrase dilemma:

What exactly dictates that this particular type of self-amendment cannot
change a noun phrase to something which is not a noun phrase, while other
self-amendments (such as the 3 silly words) can do so easily?

Yours,
Slakko
- -- 
Duncan C. "" Richer aka
Slakko the Really Lost Warner Brother - http://dcr24.quns.cam.ac.uk/
Queens' College -- PhD, Pure Maths, Graph Theory -- Cambridge University
Ackanomic - RuneMaker - Chess-Umpire - Map-Harfer - Senator - Swinger

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 07:40:24 +0000 ()
From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Hat Attack

On Sun, 25 Jan 1998, Duncan Richer wrote:

> I offer to trade this Agenda Hat in exchange for any one of the following
> Agenda hats (numbers as on the eggplants list):
> 
> 7  (created palindromic trinket)
> 8  (took possession of The Little Lamb)
> 12 (abstained on proposals divisible by 7)
> 17 (five proposals between 40% and 60%)
> 24 (danced naked on the town hall steps)
> 26 (authored five proposals in a chrome streak)

Hmmm, no-one willing to trade?
What's the point of that, then? 
*grumble*

- -- 
Duncan C. "" Richer aka
Slakko the Really Lost Warner Brother - http://dcr24.quns.cam.ac.uk/
Queens' College -- PhD, Pure Maths, Graph Theory -- Cambridge University
Ackanomic - RuneMaker - Chess-Umpire - Map-Harfer - Senator - Swinger

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 08:20:19 +0000 ()
From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: acka: television?

On Sun, 25 Jan 1998, Aaron V. Humphrey wrote:

> Let's not forget Phoebe and Ursula...  (Twin sisters from the TV show
> "Friends"; I'm not quite sure, but Ursula may have been introduced on
> "Mad About You" first.)

Yeah.  Lisa Kudrow was in MAY a long time before she started in Friends.

- -- 
Duncan C. "anyone for starting the Tribbiani Theatre Troupe?" Richer aka
Slakko the Really Lost Warner Brother - http://dcr24.quns.cam.ac.uk/
Queens' College -- PhD, Pure Maths, Graph Theory -- Cambridge University
Ackanomic - RuneMaker - Chess-Umpire - Map-Harfer - Senator - Swinger

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Jan 1998 23:54:32 -1000
From: Rico <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: My house

The following TRUE-delimited text describes my -- Slagothor's -- house.

TRUE
Name:  Room 101
Description: _Everybody_ knows what's in Room 101.
TRUE

Thanks to Alfvaen for setting me straight.

- -rico

Why is 'abbreviation' such a long word? 

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 26 Jan 1996 20:39:59 -1100
From: K 2 <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Hat

I am making one of my hats visible, it has the condition:

The owner of this hat has taken possession of the Little Lamb, while owning
this hat.

(this is hat 8)

I call this hat mutton chops.
I wear mutton chops on my head.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 26 Jan 1996 20:57:16 -1100
From: K 2 <[email-masked]>
Subject: [none]

>Subject: 
>          Acka: Little Lamb
>     Date: 
>          Sun, 25 Jan 1998 20:53:46 -1100
>     From: 
>          K 2 <[email-masked]>
>
>I am taking possesion of the little lamb and paying the associated  A$10
>fee to the treasury.

On Sun 25 Jan 4:53:46 I posted (Acka Time, im in the +11 zone) the
preceding message.

I wish to draw this to the registrar's attention. I beleive two star gained
possesion of the little lamb during the round of the spider woman (Fri, 2
Jan 1998 02:03:00 -0500 (EST)), e had had it more than a week when I took it.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 06:01:34 -0500 (EST)
From: David Scheidt <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: acka:  Witchhunt 101 results

The results are 6/5 "BURN THE WITCH!"  So, I encourage the speaker to burn
Slagothar as a witch.

rufus
Count Tabula

Burn	Goldenmean
Burn	Rex  Mundi
Burn	Rufus
Burn	Slagothar
Burn	bill tpk
Burn	else...if
No	Alfvaen
No	Red Barn
No	Slakko
No	ThinMan
No	bd

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 09:34:50 -0500
From: "Vivian Norwood" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Organizational Suggestion

> I'm still trying to find a channel I can get locally that will carry the
> new season.  It starts this weekend, doesn't it?  <fume>  Damn NBC,
> anyway.
> 
> 
> --
> --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/alfvaen/ )
> Song In My Head--Queen:Rain Must Fall
> Current Book--Tanith Lee:Dark Dance
> I have nothing to allude to, and I am alluding to it.
> 

Actually it has already started.  Dan (Onieros) is watching it, tho I am
not.  I am instead watching the repeats on TNT so that I can catch up.  I
guess I just got tired of Dan trying to explain it to me while I was
asleep.  (I talk in my sleep, so he thinks I am listening to him.)  Then
when I wake up, he assumes that I know what is going on.  Anyway, the
repeats are good, much better than when I first tried getting into it, and
I am now a definate B5 fan.  

That being said, I support Slakko's suggestion to change SPAM's name to
Minbari.  (come on guys, _anything_ is better than SPAM!) :)

Balsamic Dragon

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 09:44:46 -0500
From: "Vivian Norwood" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Hat Attack

> 
> 
> I reveal the text on one of my hats (which seems to have a large number
30
> imprinted on the inside):
> 
> The owner of this hat has been chosen as
> a judge for a call for justice (criminal or non) three times and, after
> all possible appeals are processed, has not had eir judgment overturned.
> 
> I start wearing this Agenda Hat.
> 

As the author of this hat, I believe it is now my perogative to describe
it:

The Infallable Hat:

This is a graduation style cap, with a gold tassel.  At the end of the
tassel is a small gold charm that says "Ackanomic Class of '96".  Anyone
wearing this hat publically assumes an aura of authority.  This hat also
comes with the free accessories of a white board, an overhead projector and
a long pointer.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 09:46:59 -0500
From: "Vivian Norwood" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Orgs (something different)

Sounds like a good idea to me ;)  

I also apply to join Shell #1, Shell #2 and Shell #3.  

Balsamic Dragon

- ----------
> From: Duncan Richer <[email-masked]>
> To: Ackanomic Main Mailing List <[email-masked]>
> Subject: Acka: Orgs (something different)
> Date: Sunday, January 25, 1998 4:24 AM
> 
> 
> I apply to join the Committee for Understanding: they have an open
> membership policy, so it happens.
> 
> I apply to join Shell #1.
> I apply to join Shell #2.
> I apply to join Shell #3.
> 
> (Note to rufus: The point of this is to stop other people qualifying hat
> number 2 to be true - by making these into multiplayer orgs it makes it
> that much harder for them to be members of more multiplayer orgs than any
> other player).
> 
> Yours,
> Slakko
> -- 
> Duncan C. "" Richer aka
> Slakko the Really Lost Warner Brother - http://dcr24.quns.cam.ac.uk/
> Queens' College -- PhD, Pure Maths, Graph Theory -- Cambridge University
> Ackanomic - RuneMaker - Chess-Umpire - Map-Harfer - Senator - Swinger
> 

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 10:13:08 -0500
From: "Vivian Norwood" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: acka: Going to the temple

> 
> Oh, and yes, I have submitted a CFJ on this.  I've got 3 various CFJs
> queued up with Balsamic Dragon awaiting distribution.
> 
> Yours,
> Slakko
> 

Sorry, I can't do Acka on the weekends, since it is all on my work computer
and e-mail account.  All CFJ's waiting to be distributed will be out today
(probably by early afternoon at the latest.)

Balsamic Dragon

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 10:18:40 -0500
From: "Vivian Norwood" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: acka: Going to the temple

> 
> It seems to me that game customs supports the idea that thing created by
> Rules continue to exist even after the Rule which created them is
> repealed.  Witness the "Badges of Many Thanks" that a number of players
> have, created, I am told, by a proposal before my time.  Malenkai has
> retained the title of Godfather, although the title is meaningless now
> that the Organized Crime rules are gone.  There is also custom supporting
> the idea that buildings, in particular, do not simply disappear.  So far
> as I know every building ever created in Acka remains today.  I suppose
> I'll submit a CFJ on this one.
> 

I am going to the building that used to be Vulcan Headquarters, if it still
exists, and spray-painting "Viva la Revolution!" on the walls. 

I then take a sledgehammer and whack some pieces of rock off of the walls.

I then create 5 trinkets called "Commemorative Bag #n" where n is 1 through
5.

The descriptions are "This is a commemorative bag suitable for putting
rocks in."

I then package the rocks in the commemorative bags with little bits of
revolutionary propoganda.

I am now auctioning off Commemorative Bag #s 1 through 5 as separate
parcels, minimum bid to be $A5.

Balsamic Dragon

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 10:26:29 -0500
From: "Vivian Norwood" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Expert in non-CFJs

> > I vote against this application for expertise, on the basis that
non-CFJ's
> > is not an area of the rules. Don't feel too bad, K2, I realize some of
the
> > things we've given out expert status in before also aren't areas of the
> > rules, but in this particular case I also feel that a string of bad
luck
> > (random assignments, as opposed to anything you actively did) is no
basis
> > for expert status.
> > 
> > BTW, I have no idea who the other senators are now, so please speak up
> > if you are a senator. :-)
> 
> I will agree with /dev/joe on this one, bowing to his senatorial
> expertise.
> 

Speaking for seat Melvin, I too agree with /dev/joe.

Balsamic Dragon

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 10:33:55 -0500
From: "Vivian Norwood" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka:Orgs

> 
> 	I suggest that Slakko be accepted into all organizations of which I
> am the sole member and which do not own a Secret Laboratory.
>  	I approve of all suggestions I made previously in this e-mail.
> 

Me too!  Me too!

Balsamic Dragon
(I am ninja, I am invincible!)

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 09:49:16 -0600 (CST)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Expert in non-CFJs

> Speaking for seat Melvin, I too agree with /dev/joe.
> 
> Balsamic Dragon

With this, the senate has unanimously voted against giving K 2 expert
status in non-CFJs.

/dev/joe

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 10:53:13 -0500 (EST)
From: "A.K.A. TheWiz" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: acka: Going to the temple

> If there exists an entity called Vulcan Headquarters is it a building? Or
> is it an entity of an unspecified type? Do unspecified entities have any
> effect on the game-state? Indeed, are they even ownable?
> 
> I'm not sure about the answers to any of these questions but I'm inclined
> to believe:
> No
> Yes
> Yes
> No
> Yes
> No
> No

  Strange.  I'd tend to say:
...
yes
yes
yes

> but I'm really not sure. I think the important bit is the first three
> questions. If the entity was brought into being by rule 1 then it probably
> still exists. If rule 1 merely stated that it exists then it has probably
> stopped existing.

  Fnord?

Red Barn
Minding his own business, almost

___Dan_Knapp____The_Mauve_Baron______________________Beep Blip Bonk_______
<[email-masked]><[email-masked]> http://users.bergen.org/~dankna
Change Nomic!   http://funnelweb.utcc.utk.edu/~chatham/nomicfaq.html
If it's before midnight, it's early in the morning.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 09:55:35 -0600
From: AARON KEESLER <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: acka: Org creation again

Uh... oh!  Oh, yeah!  Oops.  I either join or request to join The Moral
Kiosk, enjoying the REM song running through my mind as I do.

I transfer A$400 to The Moral Kiosk.

>-----Original Message-----
>From:	Gavin M. Doig [SMTP:[email-masked]]
>Sent:	Sunday, January 25, 1998 11:50 AM
>To:	ackanomic
>Subject:	acka: Org creation again
>
>#transfer RexBank, Rex Mundi: 675 A$.
>
>I pay the 25 A$ to create a new org entitled The Moral Kiosk.
>
>I give 650 A$ to The Moral Kiosk.
>
>I suggest that The Moral Kiosk buy a Trade License, and I approve of this;
>thus, it happens.
>
>I say *cough*400*cough* again.
>
>Rex Mundi.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 11:50:07 -0500 (EST)
From: John Frederic Mc Coy <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Very Long Land RFC

On Mon, 26 Jan 1998, Duncan Richer wrote:

> On Sun, 25 Jan 1998, **Alexandre Muniz wrote:
> 
> > John Frederic Mc Coy wrote:
> > 
> > > Kaas of Land have positions relative to each other.  They are sqaure
> > > in shape, and arranged in a grid pattern.
> > 
> > Really, they should be rhombi arranged in a quasiperiodic tiling. But
> > I'll forgive you. If we make it cartesian, however, we may as well
> > formalize the numbering system to specify kaas by. Something special
> > should be at (0,0). The Greenwich observatory? The Tower of Bandwidth?
> > The Map-Harfers house?
> 
> No, we're a city.  It should be the Ackan General Post Office (or failing
> that breadbox's house as Postmaster).

I gave some thought to this, and couldn't really decide.  Somehow the
Tower of Bandwidth does seem appropriate, but what if Guy Fawkes were to
return.

> 
> Just don't make me shake the map too hard.  Please?
> Personally I think the chessboard numbering scheme is perfectly adequate
> if we can fit it in with existing rules.
> 
> I would also like to point out that Oceans and Beaches is going to
> completely screw up the attempt to fix the land situation if it passes, so
> I suggest waiting until its voting results are known before proceeding
> further.
> 

Well, I'm certainly not going to suggest anything but a chess board style
arrangement, I'd ahve to rewrite an awful lot if I went with something
else.  As I said somewhere in the RFC, one of my biggest remaining
problems is how to interface the current map with the new system.  Perhaps
simply designating something as the "center" of Acka would suffice.
Actually, with the system I've written, I don't think coordinates are
actually *necessary*.  I was careful to state that land purchase positions
need to be specified in terms of already owned land.

I'm not sure what Oceans and Beaches does exactly (reminder, do the dumb
things I gotta do, go vote on those proposals again).  If I recall
correctly though the beach and the ocean are somewhere in the Wilds, which
would mean that, along with the rest of the Wilds, they would continualy
move farther away as the owned lands spreads outwards.

> 
> 
> > 
> > > Create a new Rule numbered 811, with the title Real Estate, with the
> > > following $$$ delimited text.
> > > 
> > > $$$
> > > A player may purchase an empty, unowned Kaa of land for A$50.  He must
> > > specify the position of this Kaa relative to some currently owned Kaa of
> > > Land which is no more than 3 Kaas away, or the purchase will fail.
> > > 
> > > A player may purchase an unowned Kaa of land with a building on it only if
> > > that building is not mentioned in the Rules.  The cost of this land is
> > > A$50 plus half the cost of the building (including the cost of any towers)
> > > on that land. If purchasing a Kaa of land would cause the building on it
> > > to be destroyed, then the player must instead pay A$50 plus the cost of
> > > the destruction of the building to purchase the Kaa.
> > > $$$
> > 
> > No player may buy more than one kaa of land per month from the treasury.
> > On the first day of each month, any empty unowned kaa of land
> > horizontally, vertically, or diagonally adjacent to three kaas of land
> > owned by the same player becomes owned by that player and any owned kaa
> > of land not containing a building that is not horizontally, vertically,
> > or diagonally adjacent to two or three owned kaas of land becomes
> > unowned. These events occur simutaneously.
> 
> But does a building become unowned if it is surrounded by 4 or more other
> buildings? :-)  You know /dev/joe's going to run riot with this.
> 

An interesting idea, but not one I would include in my proposal.  Better
to get the basics of the new system in place, things that I hope no one
finds objectionable, before doing anything wild like this.

> > 
> > Generally, I like the idea of formalizing the map, but I think that the
> > map harfer should have broad powers to rearrange things, at least when
> > there are no objections.
> 
> Give em the right to issue an MSR (Mapping Sense Report) to alter the map
> locations of buildings, provided their new locations are in accordance
> with the rules.  Under the same CSR restrictions this should be fairly
> foolproof.
> 

This is a very good idea, but again I will probably not include it in my
original proposal, so as to minimize the possibilities of people objecting
to it.

                                  - Vynd

[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 16:49:05 -0000
From: "Gavin M. Doig" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: acka: Org creation again

> Uh... oh!  Oh, yeah!  Oops.  I either join or request to join The Moral
> Kiosk, enjoying the REM song running through my mind as I do.
> 
> I transfer A$400 to The Moral Kiosk.

I suggest that The Moral Kiosk build a secret laboratory, and I approve of
this; thus, it happens.

After thinking about it for a little while, I admit Fortunato to The Moral
Kiosk. ;-)

I suggest that The Moral Kiosk use its secret lab to build a Spell Book of
Chorg; I approve of this.

Rex Mundi.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 17:04:13 -0000
From: "Gavin M. Doig" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Proposal 2611 accepted

> Regardless of the outcome of Rule 1, I think we'd like to change our name
> back. :-)
> 
> I suggest Rule 1 is repealed. #1 pay the standard harfer fee (that is,
pay
> that amount to the treasury, not pay that Malenkai's-loophole-attempt
org)
> and change its name to the following double-quote delimited string:
"Vulcan" .
> I approve this suggestion.
> 
> /dev/joe
> 
If I'd thought of it, I would have changed the name back at the end of
p2611. To make up for this, I suggest that RexBank transfer 25 A$ to Rule 1
is repealed. #1 to cover the harfer fee.

Rex Mundi.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 11:23:29 -0600 (CST)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: More Thoughts on Rule 1

Slakko wrote:
> On the noun phrase dilemma:
> 
> What exactly dictates that this particular type of self-amendment cannot
> change a noun phrase to something which is not a noun phrase, while other
> self-amendments (such as the 3 silly words) can do so easily?

This particular change specifically says that the words it is adding are
*"Vulcan's new name"*, and thus would at least seem to imply that the new
words are meant to act as a noun phrase, referring to the entity formerly
named Vulcan, which the word Vulcan in that rule formerly referred to.

The 3 silly words, on the other hand, don't specify any particular meaning
for the words, so any group of 3 words can go in there, even words whose
meaning is ambiguous -- "The organization Vulcan" could go in there easily,
and it wouldn't matter whether it referred to my party or that little
loophole-surfing org from last August.

/dev/joe

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 11:30:57 -0600 (CST)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: VULCAN: Actions

TGW wrote:
> I create a trinket, valued at A$1 called Vulcan with a description "It is a
> cruel nasty and heartless thing to do." I then give Vulcan to Rule 1 is
> repealed. #1.

OK, now, I suggest Rule 1 is repealed. #1 give this trinket to ThinMan,
and I approve the suggestion.

ThinMan, don't approve my other suggestion (about changing the name)
until this one is approved by all and you've destroyed the trinket.

/dev/joe

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 13:43:41 -0500 (EST)
From: John Frederic Mc Coy <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: VULCAN: Actions

On Mon, 26 Jan 1998, Joseph W. DeVincentis wrote:

> TGW wrote:
> > I create a trinket, valued at A$1 called Vulcan with a description "It is a
> > cruel nasty and heartless thing to do." I then give Vulcan to Rule 1 is
> > repealed. #1.
> 
> OK, now, I suggest Rule 1 is repealed. #1 give this trinket to ThinMan,
> and I approve the suggestion.
> 
> ThinMan, don't approve my other suggestion (about changing the name)
> until this one is approved by all and you've destroyed the trinket.
> 
> /dev/joe
> 

I approve the suggested transfer.

                                   - Vynd

[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 12:50:16 -0600
From: AARON KEESLER <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: acka: Going to the temple

I bid A$5 on Commemorative Bag #1.  Why not own a piece of history?  (If
such a piece exists :))

>-----Original Message-----
>From:	Vivian Norwood [SMTP:[email-masked]]
>Sent:	Monday, January 26, 1998 9:19 AM
>To:	[email-masked]
>Subject:	Re: acka: Going to the temple
>
>
>I am now auctioning off Commemorative Bag #s 1 through 5 as separate
>parcels, minimum bid to be $A5.
>
>Balsamic Dragon

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Jan 1998 14:09:12 -0500
From: "Vivian Norwood" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Fw: Re:  Acka:  CFCJ 149 (Bill the pirate king)

According to the rules, this does not have to be a public submission, but
I'm posting it just so that people know.  It seems to have become common
practice to accept judgeship in public posts.

Balsamic Dragon
Clerk of the Courts

- ----------
> From: aaron shapiro <[email-masked]>
> To: 'Vivian Norwood' <[email-masked]>
> Subject: RE: CFCJ 149 (Bill the pirate king)
> Date: Monday, January 26, 1998 12:49 AM
> 
> If I have to officially accept this then I do.   I get a week to think
bout it right?
> Sorry bout the delay in responding I was...busy...for a day
> 
> ----------
> From:  Vivian Norwood
> Sent:  Friday, January 23, 1998 12:36 PM
> To:  Ackanomic
> Subject:  CFCJ 149 (Bill the pirate king)
> 
> Bill the pirate king has been selected.
> 
> Clerk of the Courts
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> Call For Criminal Judgement 149 - January 23, 1998
> Subject: no one else gets the boot
> Initiator: else..if
> Judge: Bill the pirate king (selected January 23, 1998, 3:35 p.m.)
> Judgement:
> 
> Statement: 
> 
> Vynd has commited a crime
> 
> Reasoning:
> 
> 	Vynd announced that he was ejecting The Gingham Wearer (then known
> as no one else) from Vulcan headquarters.  However according to Rule 1,
> while an Evil Overlord of Ackanomic (retired) may eject a member of
Vulcan
> from Vulcan headquarters, Vulcan must eject a non-member from the
> headquarters.  The only reasonable interpretation of this is that it is
an
> organizational action.  Therefore Vynd is not permitted to eject any one
> not in Vulcan from Vulcan Headquarters.
> 
> Suggested Penalty:
> 
> 	Since this was an honest mistake, I'd be inclined to recommend a
> lessened penalty, however I feel some token penalty is still appropriate.
> I suggest an apology of 5 lines.
> 
> 

------------------------------

End of ackanomic digest V2 #489
*******************************