Subject: Ackanomic Digest V2 #197
From: [email-masked] (Ackanomic Digest)
To: ackanomic-digest

Ackanomic Digest        Tuesday, July 15 1997        Volume 02 : Number 197

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Date: Mon, 14 Jul 1997 22:23:04 -0900
From: Phil Ackley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Lipid 

It appears as if Lipid has unsubscribed himself from Ackanomic's mailing
lists.  What these means in term of the game state, I don't know.  LIpid
has commited a crime, perhaps?

Mr. Luntic Fringe

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 14 Jul 1997 22:25:41 -0900
From: Phil Ackley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Church and Synod 

>
>> So is the repeal of the synod your first step in making a Harfless
>> Ackanomic?  If this is the case, please say so.
>
>Lets get one thing straight here. :-)  Malenkai has never repealed a single
>rule in this nomic.  60% of the voters, or 66% in previous days, have.
>I am not trying to repeal rules.  I am proposing a solution to the
>overwhelming complexity of this game.  Acka will vote whether they agree,
>in whole or in part, with this solution, or if there is a problem.

Okay, but you still didn't answer my question.  What I (seriously) wanted
to know, is if you have a plan to make record keeping un nessecary.  If so,
I see whaer there is advantage in this.  If not, I do not see a significant
change in any harfing except by the players involved in Synod.

Mr. Lunatic Fringe

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jul 1997 11:10:55 +0300 (EET DST)
From: Uri Bruck <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: acka: Synod

On Mon, 14 Jul 1997, Joseph W. DeVincentis wrote:
> 
> Look, profits! :-)
> 
> It is interesting to note that the synod should never have to take in
> negative "profit-sharing" money from the members, because delegates
> can always vacate their seats in order to throw the synod out of session
> if that is going to happen.  Provided the delegates have been paying
> attention to finances, of course.

When the Synod rule was created it was not possible to 'give' a negative
amount of A$. Perhaps one should not depend on this.

> 
> Assuming the bugs (real or imagined) are fixed, the Synod _could_ be an
> interesting thing to watch, but I don't see it ever being anything that
> will remotely help simulate an economy.  
I was thinking of sitmulate rather than simulate

Niccolo Flychuck

> 
> /dev/joe
> 
> ------------------------------
> 

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jul 1997 11:18:19 +0300 (EET DST)
From: Uri Bruck <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: offer

On Mon, 14 Jul 1997, Joseph W. DeVincentis wrote:

> Mohammed/Chaos wrote:
> > On 14 Jul 1997 [email-masked] wrote:
> > > I am offering Chaos an Otzma Card type Fix My Gadget as a gift.
> > 	I accept this trade.  I am playing my newly acquired Fix My
> > Gadget card to fix my Orbital Mind Control Laser.
> 
> I am using my Go Fish otzma card to counter this Fix My Gadget card.
> 
> /dev/joe
> Have we ever seen one of these Go Fish cards used before?

This is definitely a first time.

Niccolo Flychuck
Rune Maker

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jul 1997 11:28:44 +0300 (EET DST)
From: Uri Bruck <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Church and Synod

On Mon, 14 Jul 1997, Malenkai wrote:

> 
> Moreover, despite allegations to the contrary, the Speaker *has* had to
> spend a decent amount of time checking the rule against the game state,
> but I am not at liberty to discuss that in detail yet ;-()  I realise some

I assume you mean your attempt to try to prove that since every Church is
Similar to itself, once it joins the Synod it is no longer eligibble to do
so (that is where you ar going with that TMBG CFJ, isn't it?) Well I don't
think that argument works, but let's leave that for a different thread.

> I have seen some rather disturbing content in print on various lists about
> proposal 2220, things alleging that proposal 2220 is "deceptively titled",
> (it is not; it will simplify the game), and rationale for keeping the
> rule drawn 100% from the fact that "I'm sick of rules being repealed 
> because Malenkai doesn't like them", in a non-humorous, non-smiley faced
> context, and without explanation or apology after I have voiced my
> distaste for such thought guiding game actions and being put in front of
> my face.
> 
> For me, its not the end of the world if proposal 2220 fails, but it is the
> end of the world if a simple proposal which I, in my heart, believe will
> make the game easier to play when /dev/joe leaves generates such hateful,
> mean-spirited content.  I almost left the game when I read that message;
> to echo Niccolo's thoughts when someome proposed the repeal of Party
> Chess -- 'I'm not sure I wish to remain in this community any longer'.
Thoughts which were a response to the context and the title of the
proposal rather than to its content. 
I think I must have missed some of those messages Malenkai refers to, and
it distresses me too.

> 
> I have tried to be forthright, objective, and debate proposal 2220 with
> class. I feel I have done so; (I feel Niccolo has done so), and hope I

Niccolo Flychuck

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jul 1997 11:37:00 +0300 (EET DST)
From: Uri Bruck <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Church and Synod

[I seem to have encountered some strange behavior the first time I sent
this, my apologies for potential duplication]

On Mon, 14 Jul 1997, Malenkai wrote:

> > It is my opinion that the synod does not add any burden of
> > complexity to any players other than those who participate in it, and thus
> > is not part of the problem facing ackanomic
> 
> 
> Moreover, despite allegations to the contrary, the Speaker *has* had to
> spend a decent amount of time checking the rule against the game state,
> but I am not at liberty to discuss that in detail yet ;-()  I realise some

I suppose this has to do with your CFJ TMBG, by which you intend to prove
that every Organization is Similar to itself, and therefore every Church
becomes ineligible for the Synod as soon as it joins. I don't think it
works, but that's a subject for a different thread.

> For me, its not the end of the world if proposal 2220 fails, but it is the
> end of the world if a simple proposal which I, in my heart, believe will
> make the game easier to play when /dev/joe leaves generates such hateful,
> mean-spirited content.  I almost left the game when I read that message;
> to echo Niccolo's thoughts when someome proposed the repeal of Party
> Chess -- 'I'm not sure I wish to remain in this community any longer'.

This had to do with context and title of that proposal rather than
contents. I must have missed some of those messages Malenkai refers to,
but it distresses me too.

 > 
> I have tried to be forthright, objective, and debate proposal 2220 with
> class. I feel I have done so; (I feel Niccolo has done so), and hope I
> have stated the reasons why I think Synod should be repealed in a clear
> manner.  I'm not asking you to agree with those reasons, but I am asking 
> you to vote on proposal 2220 based on theSynod's merits and failings,
> and the game state, and the fun it is, not based on the fact that Malenkai,
> and not Jane Curtin or Uncle Wille, wrote proposal 2220.
> 
> Please don't make this a personal issue.  Its not with me.  I have stated
> clearly, in non-personal terms, my reasons for proposing to repeal the
> Synod.  Vote your conscience on the rule, not because *I* wish to see
> it repealed.
> 
> Malenkai
> 
> ------------------------------
> 

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jul 1997 08:22:56 -0500
From: "Bollinger, John C." <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka: Phoebe

MLF wrote:

[About my latest Phoebe post]

> This, my evil twin, is Silver Moon Quality material. Kudos.
> 
Why, thanks!  I realized that I didn't have much in the way of a
message to convey, so I decided to try to make it fun and harfy.
I'm glad you liked it.

ThinMan

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jul 1997 10:53:39 -0400
From: jordan james <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka: A House Warming Party!

- -----Original Message-----
From:	Phil Ackley [SMTP:[email-masked]]
Sent:	Tuesday, July 15, 1997 12:17 AM
To:	[email-masked]
Subject:	Re: Acka: A House Warming Party!

>> I would like to take a moment to announce a house warming part this week 
at
>> my home, the Pirate Ship Revenge.  The festivities will begin this 
Thursday
>> the 17th of July at 1pm Ackanomic time, and run well into the night.
>> Please RSVP before midnight Wednesday by posting a public message 
stating
>> that you will be attending.

I will certainly be attending, although your housewarming may interfere
with a certain murder :)

Mr. Fringe

Brilliant mr fringr , so the murders taking place at the party, with a lead 
pipe, in the pool room, I GOT IT! Where's my treasure? Oh I still need the 
who
- -karma (bloodthirsty)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jul 1997 10:56:06 -0400
From: jordan james <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka: A House Warming Party!

- -----Original Message-----
From:	Hank Turowski [SMTP:[email-masked]]
Sent:	Monday, July 14, 1997 9:56 PM
To:	[email-masked]
Subject:	Acka: A House Warming Party!

I would like to take a moment to announce a house warming part this week at
my home, the Pirate Ship Revenge.  The festivities will begin this Thursday
the 17th of July at 1pm Ackanomic time, and run well into the night.
Please RSVP before midnight Wednesday by posting a public message stating
that you will be attending.  Anyone who RSVP's in time has my permission to
come aboard for the party.  In addition to chips and rum, all party goers
will receive a small gift (a trinket I have not yet finished designing)
worth A$5 or so.  Housewarming gifts will be greatfully accepted, but in no
way required.

Also, I will award a commemorative Prosthetic Forehead to whoever recites
the best original Limerick while attending my party.  Winner will by chosen
by a popular vote, all guests are welcome to enter the contest and vote
with the condition you may not vote for your own poem.  Voting will be done
via private email to me, one vote per guest.

Hope to see you all there!
Dread Pirate Roberts
 I'll be there with my wife dread and I want in on the limerikin'
- - Karma
Hank Turowski               Edmark, an IBM Company  C Code                 
[email-masked]            Redmond, WA             C Code Run             
[email-masked]  (206) 556-3651          Run Code Run... PLEASE!

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jul 1997 11:06:41 -0400
From: jordan james <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka: Corrections

- -----Original Message-----
From:	Joseph W. DeVincentis [SMTP:[email-masked]]
Sent:	Tuesday, July 15, 1997 12:35 AM
To:	[email-masked]
Subject:	Acka: Corrections

It was pointed out to me that Darth Vader and Ben were players when the
parade happened (July 5) but I failed to record the 1 point on their
scores (due to using the "current scores" list of players to mark down
parade points, when the new players hadn't been added there yet).  This
was before the last bond dividends were given out, so instead of receiving
a zero dividend, each of them actually received a dividend of A$1.

#award Darth Vader: +1 A$: late July 7 dividend
#award Ben: +1 A$: late July 7 dividend

/dev/joe

oooohhhhhhh! Good thing you caught that healthy sum before those pesky a;liens took it
- - karma

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jul 1997 11:09:50 -0400
From: jordan james <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka: Lipid

- -----Original Message-----
From:	Phil Ackley [SMTP:[email-masked]]
Sent:	Tuesday, July 15, 1997 3:23 AM
To:	[email-masked]
Subject:	Acka: Lipid

It appears as if Lipid has unsubscribed himself from Ackanomic's mailing
lists.  What these means in term of the game state, I don't know.  LIpid
has commited a crime, perhaps?

Mr. Luntic Fringe
It means he's a witch!!!!! I'll try to get the proposal through today.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jul 1997 11:17:29 -0500 (CDT)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <devjoe>
Subject: Acka: Salaries

Surprisingly, nobody complained about not being paid this month. :-)

The officer salaries were paid July 7th at noon, and they were as follows:

#award /dev/joe: +25 A$ : salary - bond-harfer 25
#award Niccolo Flychuck: +25 A$ : salary - chess-umpire 25
#award Malenkai: +25 A$ : salary - clerk of the court 25
#award Malenkai: +25 A$ : salary - count tabula 25
#award Mohammed: +25 A$ : salary - financier 25
#award /dev/joe: +25 A$ : salary - map-harfer 25
#award /dev/joe: +25 A$ : salary - postmaster 25
#award Mohammed: +25 A$ : salary - promoter 25
#award Mr. Lunatic Fringe: +25 A$ : salary - registrar 25
#award /dev/joe: +25 A$ : salary - scorekeeper 25
#award Malenkai: +35 A$ : salary - speaker 35
#award Mohammed: +25 A$ : salary - tabulator 25
#award Malenkai: +25 A$ : salary - trinket-harfer 25
#award /dev/joe: +25 A$ : salary - undead-harfer 25
#award /dev/joe: +25 A$ : salary - web-harfer 25

The office of CSRR was vacant at the time salaries were paid (Vynd was
appointed later that night).

This A$385 which I hadn't counted affects the starting salaries of every
player who has joined in the last week or so.  This also leads me to
realize that Lipid's starting cash was miscalculated (the average is over
the same players as when DPR joined, besides Lipid himself -- I think this
is the same not-counting-Darth-Vader-and-Ben error).

#award Lipid: -33 A$ : starting cash 630 not 663 (18268/29 not 17883/27)
#award Dread Pirate Roberts: +12 A$ : s.c. 622 not 610 (18638/30 not 18286/30)
#award Ace Rimmer: +12 A$ : s.c. 621 not 609 (19235/31 not 18871/31)

The more important thing to note here is that there are A$150/month worth
of offices I will resign from before the end of the month.  Alfvaen doesn't
know what sort of access he will have and Guy Fawkes can't help until
about a month later.  We need some volunteers here.

/dev/joe
"Volunteers!  We need volunteers!  Soldiers to meet them.
Have no fear.  Have no fear.  You will be killed right away."

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jul 1997 11:25:07 -0500
From: "Bollinger, John C." <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka: Salaries

/dev/joe wrote:

> The more important thing to note here is that there are A$150/month
> worth
> of offices I will resign from before the end of the month.  Alfvaen
> doesn't
> know what sort of access he will have and Guy Fawkes can't help until
> about a month later.  We need some volunteers here.
> 
I am currently more-or-less HTML-inept, which restricts my capabilities
with regard to said offices.  That being said, however, I think I am
qualified at least to harf the undead.  I would recommend that whoever
wants to harf bonds would do well to be the Scorekeeper, too, although
it is not necessary.  I probably have access to personal WWW space and
to the university's Majordomo server, but I will have to figure out
how to use each of these if I am to take over the relevant offices.

ThinMan

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jul 1997 12:50:42 -0400
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Apologies

First, I'd like to publically apologize to Mr. Lunatic Fringe for
any messages on my part that he has taken to be rude over the past
several months.  There was no rude intent on my part.

Secondly, I would like to apologize for the severe backlog at the
CotC office.  The CFJs that have been piling up will get out 
tonite :).  Feel free to submit more....

Malenkai

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jul 1997 12:01:59 -0500 (CDT)
From: Jason Orendorff <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka: Salaries

> I am currently more-or-less HTML-inept, which restricts my capabilities
> with regard to said offices.  That being said, however, I think I am
> qualified at least to harf the undead.  I would recommend that whoever
> wants to harf bonds would do well to be the Scorekeeper, too, although
> it is not necessary.  I probably have access to personal WWW space and
> to the university's Majordomo server, but I will have to figure out
> how to use each of these if I am to take over the relevant offices.
	I would like to harf the ruleset but I will be returing to
school this fall and will never find the time.  I've written a python
script that should make ruleset-harfing a great deal easier.  (This is
the script that harfs my new Blueprints page.)

	Alfvaen agreed to take Financier.  His database would be my
python database and he would manipulate it by mail.  I'm not sure what
the status on this is now.

- -- 
Chaos

------------------------------

Date: 15 Jul 1997 12:36:40 CST/CDT
From: [email-masked]
Subject: Acka: the plot thickens... 

Proposed action: that GF Mini-storage, Inc., offer Guy Fawkes one Otzma
Card type Go Fish.

As the sole member of GF Mini-storage, Inc., I support this action, and
so it happens.

I am accepting GF Mini-storage, Inc.'s offer of 1 OC Go Fish.

#transfer GF Mini-storage, Guy Fawkes : 1 Otzma Card type Go Fish

I am offering this card to Mohammed.

- --or rather I would, except that he is no longer named Mohammed.

I am offering 1 OC type Go Fish to Chaos.

Guy Fawkes

------------------------------

Date: 15 Jul 1997 12:55:26 CST/CDT
From: [email-masked]
Subject: Acka: well... 

Though I consider this in mildly poor taste, a fellow player whom I
greatly admire has run into significant potential legal fees, and my
desire to help him overwhelms what qualms I have.

I offer to trade Malenkai the Trinket Jephthah's Pride in exchange for
A$980, 5 bonus votes, the newspaper 'Round the Earth, and a Pulse Laser.

I do hope a certain disorderly personage is fully aware what e is doing
this time.

Ah well,  no one can prove any connection to me.

Guy Fawkes

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jul 1997 12:56:10 -0500 (CDT)
From: Jason Orendorff <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: well...

I am accepting Guy Fawkes' offer of one Go Fish card.  I am playing
my newly acquired Go Fish Otzma Card to counter the Go Fish played on
my Fix My Gadget card yesterday.

The upshot of this is that I get a new Fix My Gadget Card.  I play my
newly acquired Fix My Gadget Card to fix my broken Orbital Mind
Control Laser.

I am pointing my Orbital Mind Control Laser at Malenkai and zapping
him for the trade Guy Fawkes just offered him, assorted cash and
prizes for the Jephthath's Pride.  Yah.

- -- 
Chaos

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jul 1997 14:49:33 -0500 (CDT)
From: Jason Orendorff <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka:  more

I have written another article.  This one is much more interesting
than the first, and has to do with honest-to-harf Real Life current
events.  You can buy it for your Newspaper's exclusive use for A$40.

- -- 
Chaos

------------------------------

End of Ackanomic Digest V2 #197
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