Subject: Ackanomic Digest V2 #191
From: [email-masked] (Ackanomic Digest)
To: ackanomic-digest

Ackanomic Digest        Saturday, July 12 1997        Volume 02 : Number 191

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 23:32:42 -0600 (MDT)
From: Aaron Humphrey <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Stopping By

Since my account still hasn't gone away, nor has our net connection, I am
returning, briefly, from Vacation.

And I apologize for that fake *ping* message yesterday--yes, I had
forgotten to turn off my cron job, but it's gone now.

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.terranet.ab.ca/~aaron/)
Song In The Other Room--The Payola$:Eyes of A Stranger
Current Book--Heather Spears:The Taming
WARNING: This product not intended for use by stupid people.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 23:37:31 -0600 (MDT)
From: Aaron Humphrey <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Treasure

/dev/joe has found the Exquisite Dead Guy.

The map to the treasure was the same as I revealed when I buried it.
/dev/joe sent me a Python program(which I hope he will provide a copy of
for the web pages if Malenkai so wishes)accompanied by documentation which
rigorously determine the possible ranges for the pangram's letter counts,
and then runs through them all.  Since the program terminated without
producing any output, it appears that an "Ackanomic-inspired pangram" does
not exist, and by providing a proof(by exhaustion...:-), /dev/joe has
satisfied the conditions of the map.

Hopefully some other form of Ackanomic-inspired pangram does exist, and I
will devote a few spare CPU cycles to the search.  If so, the BWG will
publish it someday.

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.terranet.ab.ca/~aaron/)
Song In The Other Room--The Hooters:500 Miles
Current Book--Heather Spears:The Taming
Tell me, oh Buddha, how much do you weigh, and what's your favourite colour?

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 23:40:03 -0600 (MDT)
From: Aaron Humphrey <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Monopole (CnH)

Since I think my previous offer didn't work or expired or something, I am
once again offering Calvin N Hobbes the Gravitational Monopole to use in
reattaching houses whilst I am away.  Whether he can use it effectively in
an Acting capacity I will leave for someone else to determine.  :-)

#transfer Alfvaen, Calvin N Hobbes: Gravitational Monopole: lending

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.terranet.ab.ca/~aaron/)
Song In The Other Room--The Hooters:500 Miles
Current Book--Heather Spears:The Taming
Always avoid alliteration.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 23:48:29 -0600 (MDT)
From: Aaron Humphrey <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: To Reply

Oh, yeah, and since I'm subscribed to the digest versions of the lists
right now(and will remain so until I have a stable email address again),
anything meant for me to see right away should be cc'd to this email
address([email-masked]).  An alternate email address that is
moderately stable, in case this one does disappear, is my wife's work
email, [email-masked].

As soon as I found out for sure what Terranet's status is, I will either
get a(nother) commercial account or return to this one.  (Hey, our
Internet feed was supposed to get cut off four days ago, apparently, so
maybe something good has happened...)

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.terranet.ab.ca/~aaron/)
Song In The Other Room--Guns 'N' Roses:November Rain
Current Book--Heather Spears:The Taming
I'm here where I want to be...7000 miles from infinity.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 00:53:21 -0500 (CDT)
From: Thierry Joffrain <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Monopole (CnH) 

>Since I think my previous offer didn't work or expired or something, I am
>once again offering Calvin N Hobbes the Gravitational Monopole to use in
>reattaching houses whilst I am away.  Whether he can use it effectively in
>an Acting capacity I will leave for someone else to determine.  :-)

I accept and will try and reattach everything right away.

I will go from house to house, pointing the gizmo and pressing the buttons,
in order, of the following houses:

The Revolving Shed (mr cwm) 
AZTEC GOD's house (AZTEC GOD)
correspond to a text string consisting of an infinite number of q's (Atilla
the Pun)
two-star's house (two-star)
Zone 23 (23 Skidoo)

Then I go home. (if it broke after one I will obviously skip the rest of the
houses)

Alfvaen, do you want the Monopole back? Or can I buy it from you?

CnH

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 11 Jul 1997 23:57:42 -0600 (MDT)
From: Aaron Humphrey <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Monopole (CnH)

(Since CnH was kind enough to forward this to me privately...)

> >Since I think my previous offer didn't work or expired or something, I am
> >once again offering Calvin N Hobbes the Gravitational Monopole to use in
> >reattaching houses whilst I am away.  Whether he can use it effectively in
> >an Acting capacity I will leave for someone else to determine.  :-)
> 
> I accept and will try and reattach everything right away.

> I will go from house to house, pointing the gizmo and pressing the buttons,
> in order, of the following houses:
> 
> The Revolving Shed (mr cwm) 
> AZTEC GOD's house (AZTEC GOD)
> correspond to a text string consisting of an infinite number of q's (Atilla
> the Pun)
> two-star's house (two-star)
> Zone 23 (23 Skidoo)

I think you might have to make your statement of bravado for each house too
for the GM to work.  :-)

> Then I go home. (if it broke after one I will obviously skip the rest of the
> houses)
> 
> Alfvaen, do you want the Monopole back? Or can I buy it from you?

I think that at least one Monopole should be in the hands of the
current AckaPhysicist, since e is the person who can use it most
effectively, and should get passed along like the Pedestal of *ping*.
So I think I would like it back when I return, though of course I can't
force you.  :-)

Which reminds me(I have been remiss):

#transfer Alfvaen, fnord: Pedestal of *ping*: Custom dictates

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.terranet.ab.ca/~aaron/)
Song In The Other Room--Gordon Lightfoot:Bitter Green
Current Book--Heather Spears:The Taming
I warm my hands before the fire of life and get four-way relief.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 01:58:12 -0400
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Monopole (CnH)

> I will go from house to house, pointing the gizmo and pressing the buttons,
> in order, of the following houses:

You need permission from the owners to go to these houses (perhaps they
*want* their houses to dangle), and need suitable bravado when using
the Monopole.

Malenkai

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 01:06:12 -0500 (CDT)
From: Thierry Joffrain <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Monopole (CnH)

>You need permission from the owners to go to these houses (perhaps they
>*want* their houses to dangle), and need suitable bravado when using
>the Monopole.

I'm not going into their house, I'm staying in the street. I believe that
still works (but I've been wrong before and I think I'm wrong now). As for
bravado, I think my cavalier attitude to the whole process qualifies as
such...    ; )

Bah! All right, fine... Just don't anybody say my reaction time is slow...

CnH

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 01:10:17 -0500 (CDT)
From: Thierry Joffrain <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Monopole (who wants the be zapped?)

The following houses are dangling. I can testify that this is a bad thing
(tm) from experience. Oh yeah.

>> The Revolving Shed (mr cwm) 
>> AZTEC GOD's house (AZTEC GOD)
>> correspond to a text string consisting of an infinite number of q's (Atilla
>> the Pun)
>> two-star's house (two-star)
>> Zone 23 (23 Skidoo)

23 Skidoo is undead, so I guess he can't ask. But if anyone else allows me
onto their property, I'd be happy to use the gizmo. Even do the bravado
thing. Free. Gifts welcome, of course.

And I'll give the thingamabob back, Alfvaen, promise. Just remind me.

CnH

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 00:50:51 -0700 (PDT)
From: Brian Raiter <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Treasure

> Hopefully some other form of Ackanomic-inspired pangram does exist,
> and I will devote a few spare CPU cycles to the search.  If so, the
> BWG will publish it someday.

Here's an actual pangram, though it's not particularly satisfying:

 This Ackanomics-inspired spangram contains seven a's, one b, four c's,
 three d's, thirty-six e's, six f's, two g's, eleven h's, fifteen i's,
 one j, two k's, two l's, three m's, twenty-one n's, thirteen o's,
 three p's, one q, thirteen r's, thirty-three s's, twenty-five t's,
 two u's, seven v's, seven w's, three x's, five y's, and one z.

Note that the first line contains two more s's than the original
challenge. (I found this pangram just before I found that I had a bug
in my program involving s's....)

breadbox

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 02:56:22 -0500 (CDT)
From: Thierry Joffrain <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: New Treasure (The One Ring is now lost!) 

Before I bury this, I want to apologize for making this an especially tough
map to solve. I could be proved wrong, but let's just say it shouldn't be
solvable through a rotation decoding method. The decode format in two of the
steps (there are more than 6) is human solvable, but would require a complex
program for a machine. It's that hard because the object buried is that
important.

I am burying as Treasure the Majik "The One". The description of that Majik
is as follows:

>This trinket is Majik. It is sapphire bullet of pure love number 800. It is 
>a ring of pure gold with some delicate elvish inscriptions inside. The
>inscription says: 
>'One for the Dark Lord on his dark throne, 
>on the top side of Acka where the Shadows lie. 
>One ring to rule them all, One ring to find them, 
>One ring to bring them all and in the darkness bind them.' 

Here is part of the map:

- -----------------------cut here-----------------------

Decode the following, sending it to the public forum in message correctly
explaining the decoding (can't be a wild guess):

OS  Y   n jdYdK bQ
 jKSzKJYnCE-jJbh-j
 K        l C C Il

- -----------------------cut here-----------------------

A few hints. Working in a constant size character set is vital. Also, one
might consider this to be an unorthodox quipu with a twist, to start with.
There is a need for two alphanumeric decoding keys later, which are more
than 98% identical, and both have a prime number of symbols. What else?
Huh... good luck!!

CnH

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 12:36:58 +0300 (EET DST)
From: Uri Bruck <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka:  Proposal 2220

On Fri, 11 Jul 1997, Malenkai wrote:

> Um, your quote was:
> 
> > > > The thing is, if acka is ever to have an economy, it would need such
> > > > entities. 

Such entities does not mean necessarily this entity, or identical ones.
Just generally entities that deal with economy.
> 
> My example about the state of PA was disproof of your assertion by
> counterexample.  I still maintain, because I have demonstrated with the
> state of PA example, that we do not need rule 1303 to have an economy.
> For example, it is possible for acka's memebership laws, resources, etc
> to become identical to those of the state of PA.  A far fetched example,
> but since it is common sense, to me anyway, that rule 1303 is not needed
> to have an economy, the proof was intentionally far fetched.

You have demonstrated nothing, if acka had institutions to parallel those
of the state of Pensylvania, then you might be right. But it doesn't.

> The differences are:
> 
> 1) The Phoebe rule is fun

Not for me.

> 2) The Phoebe rule is used
Some players just ignore it, and take the penalty.

> 4) Before Phoebe, no one posted wisdom, now its part of our culture; 
> Before Synod, orgs did not shuffle trivial amounts of money around based
> on the arcane perscription of rule 1303, andthey still don't.  If they
> wanted to, the would either form a contract (a used simple rule), or
> make an informal agreement amongst themselves.

I agree that Synod would have worked better if Acka were larger, in fact I
stated as much whenever this discussion came up.

> 
> Again, why can't we keep the discussion on the merits and failings of
> rule 1303, and not try to keep shifting the discussion to other rules
> that have nothing to do with it, and no similarities with it?

I stated the merits. They're in the bits you chose no to quote.

> 
> ({{braces}}

A kludge taht makes reading proposals next to impossible.

> , gumball, parades, trombones, 

A collection of entities and activities, each of which have wildly
differing condition to track.

>party chess);
The author of that repeal stated that it was sort of a grudge proposal,
and retracted it the next day.

> I propose to 
> repeal a rule that has *none* of those characteristics, that has been
> dead weight in the ruleset forever, and people want to save it.  This
> makes no sense to me.

It would have been deadweight it had actually forced us to track things
and added more work. It does none of those and therefore cannot be
clasified as dead weight.

Niccolo Flychuck

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 12:40:56 +0300 (EET DST)
From: Uri Bruck <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka:  Proposal 2220

On Fri, 11 Jul 1997, Joseph W. DeVincentis wrote:

> I assumed you wanted somebody else to do it since you were already a delegate.

I don't mind who does it as long as it's done. Anyway, as the member of
Seleya who petitioned for this, I assumed that you would have assumed that
I would gladly take the job.

> Seleya is buying a Synod seat and I appoint Niccolo Flychuck as Delegate.
> 
> /dev/joe
> 
> ------------------------------
> 

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 12:37:58 +0300 (EET DST)
From: Uri Bruck <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka:  Proposal 2220

On Fri, 11 Jul 1997, Bollinger, John C. wrote:

> 
> On the other hand, I agree that the change suggested by NF would
> improve the situation, and mitigate /dev/joe's criticism.  I don't
> really think that the problem he pointed out has much to do with why
> the rule hasn't been used.  To the contrary, it seems to me that it
> hasn't been used because there is little interest.  That seems to me
> to be sufficient reason to get rid ofthe rule.

It elminates a point which irrelevant to the discussion.

Niccolo Flychuck

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 13:11:32 +0300 (EET DST)
From: Uri Bruck <[email-masked]>
Subject: acka : Synod

The Synod is now in session.

Mr. Lunatic Fringe is Delegate for the Church of the Markovian Dream
Niccolo Flychuck is Delegate for the Church of Odo on the Wormhole
Niccolo Flychuck is Delegate for the Churchof Seleya

All three Churches are the same size, but the Church of the Markovian
Dream had the Seat for the longset duration, so Mr. Lunatic Fringe is the
Yor-Delegate.

Well, I guess the Synod is being used now!

Niccolo Flychcuk

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 13:59:56 +0300 (EET DST)
From: Uri Bruck <[email-masked]>
Subject: acka : Synod - proposal 2220

As I mentioned earlier, the Synod is now in Session, the rule is being
used, and, as now seems obvious, the reason it was underused for the last
couple of months was due a slight misunderstanding.
Since Malenkai's arguments center on the point of that the rule is not
being used, they are no longer based in fact. I think the propor thing to
do would be to retract proposal 2220.

Niccolo Flychuck

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 14:03:49 +0300 (EET DST)
From: Uri Bruck <[email-masked]>
Subject: acka : Synod is not on the entities page

Why are the Synods's assets not on the player entities page?

It had A$400

Niccolo Flychuck

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 09:05:48 -0500
From: "Bollinger, John C." <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka: the 'bot

Mohammed wrote:

> Does anyone object to my changing the bot to send out texts of failed
> proposals? 
> 
I don't feel strongly about it, but I'd kinda like it if it _would_.

ThinMan

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 10:11:57 -0400
From: jordan james <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka: Monopole (CnH)

- -----Original Message-----
From:	Thierry Joffrain [SMTP:[email-masked]]
Sent:	Saturday, July 12, 1997 1:53 AM
To:	[email-masked]
Subject:	Re: Acka: Monopole (CnH)

>Since I think my previous offer didn't work or expired or something, I am
>once again offering Calvin N Hobbes the Gravitational Monopole to use in
>reattaching houses whilst I am away.  Whether he can use it effectively in
>an Acting capacity I will leave for someone else to determine.  :-)

I accept and will try and reattach everything right away.

I will go from house to house, pointing the gizmo and pressing the buttons,
in order, of the following houses:

The Revolving Shed (mr cwm) 
AZTEC GOD's house (AZTEC GOD)
correspond to a text string consisting of an infinite number of q's (Atilla
the Pun)
two-star's house (two-star)
do you think you my see it yhrough to give zone 23 a little push instead of reattaching it cnh?

- - karma (willing to pay if zone 23 were to slip off of the map)
Zone 23 (23 Skidoo)

Then I go home. (if it broke after one I will obviously skip the rest of the
houses)

Alfvaen, do you want the Monopole back? Or can I buy it from you?

CnH

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 10:39:04 -0400
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: acka : Synod - proposal 2220

> Since Malenkai's arguments center on the point of that the rule is not
> being used, they are no longer based in fact. I think the propor thing to
> do would be to retract proposal 2220.

These statements are inaccurate.  My arguments were based on the fact
that we do not need the rule, that it is overly complex for the trivial
amount of money that is shuffled around by its arcane perscription, and
that there is miniscule interest in it in acka, and that there is no 
game advantage for an org to join it.  IMO, none of these arguments have
been successfully countered; indeed, 3 other players have added their
support to them.  It was also clear that 4 out of 5 members of Seleya
at the time did *not* wish to participate in Synod (at least enough to
volunteer to be delegate); I can only speak for my reasons, which are
listed above, thus I argue that the reason it has not been used is not
"obvious".  As I pointed out previously, which was not responded to,
orgs other than Seleya were eligible to join, and chose not to.
 
I believe we are at an agree-to-disagree situation here, and I shall
bow out of this debate at this time.  I think everyone has weighed in for
or against rule 1303 who is going to do so, and acka is most likely bored
of this by now.  When someone is calling for the proposal's retraction
before the major issues of the debate are resolved, its time to end the
debate. :-)  The debate has been vigorous and enjoyable for me, as I hope
it was for others.  I like a good acka debate sometimes, especially when
general bandwidth usage is down, as it seems to be now :)

Malenkai

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 11:04:23 -0400
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: CFCJ 138 (AZTEC G0D)

AZTEC G0D has been selected.

#award mohammed : -20A$

Clerk of the Courts
- -----------------------------------------------------------------
Call for Criminal Judgement 138
  Subject: Big Tenant
Initiator: Mohammed
    Judge: AZTEC G0D (selected Jul 12, 1997, 11:04h EDT)
Judgement:

Statement:

Robert Sevin has committed a Crime.

Mohammed's Reasoning:

Rule 1009 (Big Tents and Rewarding Party Unity) says:

> An Organization that has a Big Tent is called a Political Party. It
> is a Crime to be a member of more than one Political Party at once.

Robert Sevin is a member of both Metamorph and Harf, two Organizations
each of which owns a Big Tent.

Recommended Penalty:

A DEDUCTION of 10,000,000 points.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 12:03:36 -0400
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Treasure

> /dev/joe sent me a Python program(which I hope he will provide a copy of
> for the web pages if Malenkai so wishes)accompanied by documentation which
> rigorously determine the possible ranges for the pangram's letter counts,
> and then runs through them all. 

I'll put it up there on the found page if you guys want, so long as its
not too big.  I have a 5 meg quota.

Malenkai
unofficial treasure-harfer

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 12:35:54 -0400
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Museum & Stuff

In the thread we've been playing, the beldin's pants rule eats
the "Tasteless Trinket of Timekeeping" from the museum.

In other news, the prez has probably broken the speed rule in regards
to appointing a justice, and some entity harfer should check if that
key rule has been followed each week; if not we should amend it
so that it is followed, or repeal it.  Also, the Yor Delegate should
track the Synod state.  Can't think of anything else right now.

Malenkai
Speaker

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 15:14:35 -0400 (EDT)
From: John Frederic Mc Coy <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: New flash

I have sucessfuly fixed (ie, reinstalled almost everything) my computer, I
think.  So no vacation for me.  In other news, I have decided Malenkai is
right, and I am still working on the blueprint for Lushrike, not Trumpy.If
anyone has problems with that, well, I'm guess I'll just ahve to pay the
price. =)

                               - Vynd

[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 15:15:53 -0400 (EDT)
From: John Frederic Mc Coy <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: We have a new player in Ackanomic

On Thu, 10 Jul 1997, Phil Ackley wrote:

> Read the subject line.
> 
> His name is Dread Pirate Roberts (20 characters, if I counted right) and
> his email address is [email-masked]>.  He has chosen Voting status,
> and his real name is Hank Turowski.

heh, is the "Elwes" still around?  I'd look, but I haven't fixed my web
browser yet...

                                  - Vynd

[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 15:35:11 -0400 (EDT)
From: John Frederic Mc Coy <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka: the 'bot

On Sat, 12 Jul 1997, Bollinger, John C. wrote:

> 
> Mohammed wrote:
> 
> > Does anyone object to my changing the bot to send out texts of failed
> > proposals? 
> > 
> I don't feel strongly about it, but I'd kinda like it if it _would_.

Likewise.

> 
> ThinMan
> 
> 

                                   - Vynd

[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 14:49:40 -0500 (CDT)
From: Thierry Joffrain <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Trade 

I am offering the Majik Nenya to Vynd for A$80.

#transfer vynd cnh : Nenya : trade
#transfer cnh vynd : A$80 : trade

CnH

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 16:03:30 -0400 (EDT)
From: John Frederic Mc Coy <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Trade

On Sat, 12 Jul 1997, Thierry Joffrain wrote:

> I am offering the Majik Nenya to Vynd for A$80.
> 
> #transfer vynd cnh : Nenya : trade
> #transfer cnh vynd : A$80 : trade

I accept this trade.  I am going to Lothlorien, if such place exists,
where I will use my new found powers to erect a Lord of the Rings Theme
Park.

                                    - Vynd

[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 12:11:40 -0900
From: Phil Ackley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Transaction 

I am giving two bonus votes to the church of  Odo in the wormhole.

I am giving two bonus votes to the church of the markovian dream.

Mr. Lunatic Fringe

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 12:21:26 -0900
From: Phil Ackley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: CFCJ 138 (AZTEC G0D) 

I don't think 1 billion points is a big enough penalty for a criminal like
RObert Sevin, a man who has exceeded me as Ackanomics biggest criminal.
Lets deduct 10 x 10^100 points.  I think it would be more fitting.

Mr. Luinatic Fringe

Oh yeah, don't forget to throw hi in Gaol too! :)

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 12:23:00 -0900
From: Phil Ackley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: We have a new player in Ackanomic 

>On Thu, 10 Jul 1997, Phil Ackley wrote:
>
>> Read the subject line.
>>
>> His name is Dread Pirate Roberts (20 characters, if I counted right) and
>> his email address is [email-masked]>.  He has chosen Voting status,
>> and his real name is Hank Turowski.
>
>heh, is the "Elwes" still around?  I'd look, but I haven't fixed my web
>browser yet...
>
>                                  - Vynd
>
>[email-masked]

I reccomened he find it in a private message. Funny :)

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 13:26:03 -0700
From: Hank Turowski <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: We have a new player in Ackanomic

OK, I've just spent the last hour or so looking at the various treasure
maps around, and find myself completely confused.  There seem to be some
common themes showing up in the maps (the are puzzles of similar types) but
I'm not able to make progress on any of them, so here is my question for you.

Can you give me a run down of th emajor types of puzzles I will encounted
in the game and show me where I can find some sample problems and their
solutions.

For example, the /dev/joe's legacy map and the parade description... I have
no clue what they were supposed to mean, but everyone else in the game
seemed to catch right on.

Also the map that went out today the One Ring... I don't even understand
the question, much less how to start solving it.

Can you give me a push in the right direction?

Hank
- ----
Hank Turowski               Edmark, an IBM Company  C Code                 
[email-masked]            Redmond, WA             C Code Run             
[email-masked]  (206) 556-3651          Run Code Run... PLEASE!

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 13:30:25 -0700
From: Hank Turowski <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: We have a new player in Ackanomic

Um, Ok, I'm a little embarrassed but I'm new to the game so cut me some
slack.  This was meant for my mentor. :)  But I'll take your help if you
want to offer it.

Hank

At 01:26 PM 7/12/97 -0700, you wrote:
>OK, I've just spent the last hour or so looking at the various treasure
>maps around, and find myself completely confused.  There seem to be some
>common themes showing up in the maps (the are puzzles of similar types) but
>I'm not able to make progress on any of them, so here is my question for you.
>
>Can you give me a run down of th emajor types of puzzles I will encounted
>in the game and show me where I can find some sample problems and their
>solutions.
>
>For example, the /dev/joe's legacy map and the parade description... I have
>no clue what they were supposed to mean, but everyone else in the game
>seemed to catch right on.
>
>Also the map that went out today the One Ring... I don't even understand
>the question, much less how to start solving it.
>
>Can you give me a push in the right direction?
>
>Hank
>----
>Hank Turowski               Edmark, an IBM Company  C Code                 
>[email-masked]            Redmond, WA             C Code Run             
>[email-masked]  (206) 556-3651          Run Code Run... PLEASE!
>
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 17:31:53 -0400
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Trade/Treasure

> I am burying as Treasure the Majik "The One". The description of that Majik
> is as follows:

> > I am offering the Majik Nenya to Vynd for A$80.
> >
> > #transfer vynd cnh : Nenya : trade
> > #transfer cnh vynd : A$80 : trade
> 
> I accept this trade.

Neither of these actions succeed.  As far as I can determine, Majiks
are non-tradeable entities.

Malenkai

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 16:49:09 -0500 (CDT)
From: Thierry Joffrain <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Trade/Treasure 

>> > #transfer vynd cnh : Nenya : trade
>> > #transfer cnh vynd : A$80 : trade
>> 
>> I accept this trade.
>
>Neither of these actions succeed.  As far as I can determine, Majiks
>are non-tradeable entities.

R515 says:
>A trade that offers or requests any entity that is not tradeable is illegal. 

It also says:
>A Player may offer a trade of one group of entities for another, by sending 
>a public message specifying the entities offered (if any) and the entities 
>requested (if any), if and only if the trade is legal.

R511 does not say that Majik are not tradeable. Thus it can't be illegal.

Hence it is legal to trade Majik.

CnH

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 17:54:40 -0400
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Trade/Treasure

> R515 says:
> > A trade that offers or requests any entity that is not tradeable
> > is illegal.
> 
> It also says:
> > A Player may offer a trade of one group of entities for another, by 
> > sending a public message specifying the entities offered (if any) and
> > the entities requested (if any), if and only if the trade is legal.
> 
> R511 does not say that Majik are not tradeable. Thus it can't be illegal.
> 
> Hence it is legal to trade Majik.

Rule 500.2 says:

> Each entity is either unownable, nontradeable, tradeable, or gift,
> except that a gift entity is also tradeable. An entity is nontradeable 
> unless the Rules specify otherwise. 

I did not find anywhere in the rules where it said Majiks are tradeable.
I did a grep.  Unless the rules say somewhere that Majiks are tradeable,
or there is some clause stronger than that of rule 500.2 via precedence,
it would appear that actions attempted with Majiks under the assumption
that they are tradeable do not succeed.

Malenkai

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 14:58:01 -0700
From: Alexandre Muniz <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Trade/Treasure

Thierry Joffrain wrote:
> 
> >> > #transfer vynd cnh : Nenya : trade
> >> > #transfer cnh vynd : A$80 : trade
> >>
> >> I accept this trade.
> >
> >Neither of these actions succeed.  As far as I can determine, Majiks
> >are non-tradeable entities.
> 
> R515 says:
> >A trade that offers or requests any entity that is not tradeable is illegal.
> 
> It also says:
> >A Player may offer a trade of one group of entities for another, by sending
> >a public message specifying the entities offered (if any) and the entities
> >requested (if any), if and only if the trade is legal.
> 
> R511 does not say that Majik are not tradeable. Thus it can't be illegal.
> 
> Hence it is legal to trade Majik.
> 
> CnH
R500.2: "Each entity is either unownable, nontradeable, tradeable, or
gift, except that a gift entity is also tradeable. An entity is
nontradeable unless the Rules specify otherwise."

R511 does not say that Majiky are not nontradable. However, it does say:
"Majiks are no longer trinkets but keep the value, name and description
(or amended description) they had when trinkets."

presumably, retaining value implies retaining tradability, although it
could be argued otherwise.

**two-star

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 17:07:00 -0500 (CDT)
From: Thierry Joffrain <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Trade/Treasure 

>> Each entity is either unownable, nontradeable, tradeable, or gift,
>> except that a gift entity is also tradeable. An entity is nontradeable 
>> unless the Rules specify otherwise. 

Where in R511 does it say that Majik are entities?

CnH

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 15:31:27 -0700 (PDT)
From: Brian Raiter <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka: the 'bot

> Does anyone object to my changing the bot to send out texts of
> failed proposals?

No strong preference, but I kind of like it as it is. (Though maybe
that's just because that's the way nomicbot worked.)

breadbox

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 15:39:33 -0700 (PDT)
From: Brian Raiter <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Treasure

>> /dev/joe sent me a Python program(which I hope he will provide a
>> copy of for the web pages if Malenkai so wishes)accompanied by
>> documentation which rigorously determine the possible ranges for
>> the pangram's letter counts, and then runs through them all.
> 
> I'll put it up there on the found page if you guys want, so long as
> its not too big.  I have a 5 meg quota.

Actually, I'd be more interested in the proof which shows the possible
ranges for each letter. (I imagine the program that does the
exhaustive search is more or less straightforward.)

breadbox

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 17:52:50 -0600 (MDT)
From: Aaron Humphrey <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Contraction

Oh, yes, forgot about this.  I am signing the Postcard Contract that
Mohammed buried as part of his Treasure(I don't think I need to, but what
the heck)and giving it back to him, pending his ack.  A postal address
somewhere on the Earth will be coming privately.

I am signing the Silver Shovel Contract.

I am also signing Red Barn's "Tie" Contract #24601.  (Does the Oscar
allow one to do anything that one wouldn't be able to do otherwise?)

- --
- --Alfvaen(Web page: http://www.terranet.ab.ca/~aaron/)
Current Album--The Empire Strikes Back Soundtrack
Current Book--Heather Spears:The Taming
There should be trembling, there should be sorrow.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 12 Jul 1997 16:03:50 -0900
From: Phil Ackley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Observation 

I just got back from watching Contact (great movie, go see it!) and it
started me thinking--thinking about the ETP and synod repeals, about the
sterilization of the ruleset, about the moves towards standardization,
bueracracy, and (i can think of no better word) nit-picking.

In the movie Contact, jodie fosters character was an astronomer working on
the SETI project.  The powers that be (in the fgorm af a malevolant
buerocracy) kept cutting the funding for her work, or pulled the equipment
out form under her, or whatever.  He "supervisor" (played by Tom Skerrit)
did everything in his power to obstruct her her work, and to tell her how
improbable it was, what a waste of time it was.

They made every effort to cancel the project before she could attain her
goals (or even find out if they were possible). They didn't do this with a
mean spirit, they just felt that it was a waste of their time and effort,
and money, and it didn't seem possible.  The goals she was trying to
achieve were not withing their established framework!

Thats sort of what Ackanomic is like, as of late.  I had ETP, it was my pet
project, but an "over-zeleaous beuracracy" got rid of it before we were
even able to apply one test case.  Niccolo Flychuck has the Synod, which
also looks doomed to be repealed now that it finally has got its feet wet.

When the aliens were new there was a movement by the xenophobes to ggit rid
of them, it failed, but it's another case of the same.

We all have our pet projects, and I hate to see them die before their time.
In all seriousness, what harm is their in having the synod in the ruleset.
What harm is there in having a rule that makes chess nuts boasting in an
open foyer a crime?  It's not these rules that add unneeded complxity to
the ruleset, its the rules that guide our daily play--voting, poroposing,
justice, etc.  These things effect all of us and are getting more and more
complex.

Mr. Lunatic Fringe
Rambling

------------------------------

End of Ackanomic Digest V2 #191
*******************************