Subject: Ackanomic Digest V1 #487
From: [email-masked] (Ackanomic Digest)
To: ackanomic-digest

Ackanomic Digest       Tuesday, January 28 1997       Volume 01 : Number 487

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 00:59:39 -0500
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka

Dan Knapp (A.K.A. TheWiz) wrote:

>   If you argue that this is illegal - that is, that trinkets cannot
> manipulate themselves - I refer you to Malenkai's (I think it was his)
> chest, which can contain other entities and cannot be opened without the
> appropriate key.

Trinket descriptions have no legal sway whatsoever.  However, there are
ways to make it seem like Trinkets work as their descriptions claim.
The Treasures of Jara, as alluded to here, are an example.

Malenkai

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 00:05:02 -0600
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <devjoe>
Subject: Acka: *ping* 

Today is Tuesday, the 28th day of January, in the Year of Our Lord 1997, 
and the Machine That Goes *ping* Has Gone *ping* today. 
Since I have been scholar, the Machine has gone *ping* 12 times. 

/dev/joe
Scholar of *ping*

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 01:06:50 -0500
From: Dan Knapp (A.K.A. TheWiz) <[email-masked]>
Subject: Ackarobot 

#help
#current
#vote 1688 yes
#vote 1689 yes
#vote 1670 yes

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 01:10:55 -0500
From: Dan Knapp (A.K.A. TheWiz) <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka:Scroll of Crumble Auction 

> I bid A$300.
>
> snowgod

  You're a bit late, as my last bid was for A$610; nobody's topped that,
yet.  You wouldn't be trying to usurp my title again, now would you? :)

- -Red Barn

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 01:16:22 -0500
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Hearing 105

Dan Knapp (A.K.A. TheWiz) wrote:
> 
> #help
> #current
> #vote 1688 yes
> #vote 1689 yes
> #vote 1670 yes

I am calling a snowgod's disease hearing as a result of this
post.  Reply to this message to vote.

Malenkai

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 01:14:06 -0500
From: Dan Knapp (A.K.A. TheWiz) <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka 

> Trinket descriptions have no legal sway whatsoever.  However, there are
> ways to make it seem like Trinkets work as their descriptions claim.
> The Treasures of Jara, as alluded to here, are an example.

  So, I suppose, the player owning the trinkets will simply have to carry
out the steps "by hand", as it were... this works, I think, except that one
could create "counterfeit" Ackapennies, which kind of spoils what I had in
mind - might still work, though.  The trinket system is clearly not the
best for such things, although I'm not sure exactly what would be better.

- -Red Barn

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 01:20:38 -0500
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Hearing 105

Malenkai wrote:

> I am calling a snowgod's disease hearing as a result of this
> post.  Reply to this message to vote.

Sorry about that.  The valid responses are:

Why just yesterday e posted a message to eir aunt [or something like that]
Uh, no, e meant to do that.

BTW, the acrobot probably did not get your post, as it had the wrong
subject line.

Malenkai

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 27 Jan 1997 21:00:43 -0900
From: Phil Ackley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka:  Proposal 1681 

>>Amend R207.1 by replacing all occurances of the phrase "cows eat grass"with
>>the complete text of R207.1
>
>  You mean _before_ this proposal, right?  Then we get:
>
>  If an accepted proposal contains the phrase
>    "If an accepted proposal contains the phrase "cows eat grass", then
>    the player who submitted the proposal is said to be silly, and shall
>    score 5 points",
>  then the player who submitted the proposal is said to be silly, and
>  shall score 5 points.
>
>  This makes no sense to me.
>
>-Red Barn

Actually, You'd get a proposal in the process of infinite recursion...
snowgod

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 27 Jan 1997 21:06:06 -0900
From: Phil Ackley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka:  Proposal 1684 

>Jason Orendorff wrote:
>>
>> Proposal 1684
>> 's Bribery
>> snowgod
>
>Several proposals in the recent batch had chopped titles.  Are these
>the indended titles from the author, titles chosen by the promoter,
>the bot, or something else?
>
>Malenkai
>curious

This one was supposed to be Debtors Bribery. Saw another one,m that was
chopped, but cannot remember what it was (maybe Honoring mr cwm).

Oh well,
snowgod

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 27 Jan 1997 21:08:08 -0900
From: Phil Ackley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka:  Whither Red Barn 

>Why is Red Barn in theAckanomic Afterlife
>
>Jammer
>John-Martin Lotz
>[email-masked]

Because he was burned as a witch.  It should be noted that I am now in the
Museum, also.

snowgod

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 27 Jan 1997 21:35:22 -0900
From: Phil Ackley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: New Observer 

We have a new observer, and , he doesn't hail from WebTV.net.  As a matter
of fact, he hails from the Pumpkin Patch, a nomic who's fate has becom
increasingly tied to Ackanomic's own.

Welcome Brandon Kruse <[email-masked]> to the game!

snowgod
Registrar

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 01:30:38 -0500
From: Dan Knapp (A.K.A. TheWiz) <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka:  Proposal 1681 

> Actually, You'd get a proposal in the process of infinite recursion...

  It couldn't take _forever_ - the action's performed as soon as it's
declared, after all.  Updating the web page might be a bit hard, though...

- -Red Barn
Quote of the moment:
Did you hear about the new Cray?
It's so fast, it executes an infinite loop in five seconds!

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 01:33:02 -0500
From: Dan Knapp (A.K.A. TheWiz) <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re:Acka: New Observer 

> We have a new observer, and , he doesn't hail from WebTV.net.  As a matter
> of fact, he hails from the Pumpkin Patch, a nomic who's fate has becom
> increasingly tied to Ackanomic's own.
>
> Welcome Brandon Kruse <[email-masked]> to the game!

  Does this mean we can open trade negotiations? :)

- -Red Barn

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 27 Jan 1997 21:41:27 -0900
From: Phil Ackley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re:Acka: New Observer 

>  Does this mean we can open trade negotiations? :)
>
>-Red Barn

I am working on that very issue right now with Dr West of the Pumpkin patch
and Sbuchaza.

snowgod

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 00:42:32 -0600 (CST)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <devjoe>
Subject: Acka: NOW you can post a magic letter

My cron job sent out recently:
> Today is Tuesday, the 28th day of January, in the Year of Our Lord 1997, 
> and the Machine That Goes *ping* Has Gone *ping* today. 
> Since I have been scholar, the Machine has gone *ping* 12 times. 
> 
> /dev/joe
> Scholar of *ping*

NOW you can pick a magic letter!

Anybody?

/dev/joe

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 01:39:02 -0500
From: Dan Knapp (A.K.A. TheWiz) <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re:Acka: New Observer 

> I am working on that very issue right now with Dr West of the Pumpkin patch
> and Sbuchaza.
>
> snowgod

  Very, very interesting.  Just make sure it's possible for smugglers to
pass through...

- -Red Barn

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 01:41:20 -0500
From: Dan Knapp (A.K.A. TheWiz) <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re:Acka: NOW you can post a magic letter 

> NOW you can pick a magic letter!
>
> Anybody?

  Oh, goodie!  I choose 't'.

- -Red Barn

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 01:45:41 -0500
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: NOW you can post a magic letter

Joseph W. DeVincentis wrote:

> NOW you can pick a magic letter!
> 
> Anybody?

Wish I could.  D'oh, bit by my own rule change again :)

Malenkai
who is wondering what happens between now and the 6th of Feb

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 01:05:24 -0600 (CST)
From: Jason Orendorff <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Hearing 105

> Why just yesterday e posted a message to eir aunt [or something like that]
- --Mohammed

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 01:11:03 -0600 (CST)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <devjoe>
Subject: Acka: Machine: AARRGGHH!!

AAARRRGH! 
While I was preparing this message, I realized that when I last posted
the truth, I forgot an R!!!!!
In the spirit of fairness, I'm drawing attention to this so everybody
can see what happened.  I honestly hope somebody didn't figure out
but not guess the real truth earlier due to my mistake.

Anyway...

Red Barn named t as the magic letter.
Red Barn -15 magic letter t

Yes, I recall there being several t's (and one additional r) in the truth:

IF AND ONLY IF today *** * **t* **t* **r* *r t** *****r**t *r*** ***t*r*,
THEN the Machine That Goes *ping* shall go *ping*.

/dev/joe
Lousy Scholar
Playing too many subgames at once

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 01:23:40 -0600 (CST)
From: Jason Orendorff <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Hearing 105

>   The last thing I want is to have 50 hearings going at once again, but -
>   I am calling for a snowgod's disease hearing on Mohammed for that post.
	*sigh*

- --Mohammed

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 02:33:41 -0500
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Machine: AARRGGHH!!

Joseph W. DeVincentis wrote:

> IF AND ONLY IF today *** * **t* **t* **r* *r t** *****r**t *r*** ***t*r*,
> THEN the Machine That Goes *ping* shall go *ping*.

> IF AND ONLY IF today has a date with more or two different prime factors,
> THEN the Machine That Goes *ping* shall go *ping*.

Malenkai

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 02:36:18 -0500
From: Dan Knapp (A.K.A. TheWiz) <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Machine: AARRGGHH!! 

> > IF AND ONLY IF today has a date with more or two different prime factors,
> > THEN the Machine That Goes *ping* shall go *ping*.
>
> Malenkai

  Doesn't make sense.  In particular the word "more" makes it
ungrammatical.  (I believe I have it).  Who will it be?  Who can defy all
odds and become our new scholar, despite so many wrong guesses?

- -Red Barn

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 01:44:29 -0600 (CST)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <devjoe>
Subject: Re: Acka: Machine: AARRGGHH!!

Malenkai wrote:
> IF AND ONLY IF today has a date with more or two different prime factors,
> THEN the Machine That Goes *ping* shall go *ping*.

Obviously my wrong post didn't bother Malenkai too much.  This guess is
much, much farther from the truth than my post of the truth with the r's
filled in was from what I should have posted.

/dev/joe
Somebody's gotta be able to figure this one out!
Still trying to absorb all of the aspects to Malenkai's new treasure, just
as I'm on the trail of finding *one* of his old ones.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 02:51:55 -0500
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Machine: AARRGGHH!!

Joseph W. DeVincentis wrote:
> 
> Malenkai wrote:
> > IF AND ONLY IF today has a date with more or two different prime factors,
> > THEN the Machine That Goes *ping* shall go *ping*.
> 
> Obviously my wrong post didn't bother Malenkai too much.  This guess is
> much, much farther from the truth than my post of the truth with the r's
> filled in was from what I should have posted.

At least its the first guess that *could* have been right.  Nothing in
rule says anything about grammer, and none of the previous guesses
had a chance of representing a legal truth.

Malenkai
who is still curious, and looking a little silly

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 01:59:41 -0600 (CST)
From: Jason Orendorff <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka:  bot

The #vote command is now all the way up, so you can

	#vote 1500 y y y n n n

to vote yes on proposals 1500-1502 and no on 1503-1505.

I'm sure you've all been awaiting this moment with bated breath, or 
something.

- --Mohammed

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 27 Jan 1997 23:12:03 -0900
From: Phil Ackley <[email-masked]>
Subject: acrobot 

#current
#thanks

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 00:05:39 -0800
From: [email-masked] (John Martin Lotz)
Subject: Re: Acka: Machine: AARRGGHH!!

Anyway...

Red Barn named t as the magic letter.
Red Barn -15 magic letter t

Yes, I recall there being several t's (and one additional r) in the truth:

IF AND ONLY IF today *** * **t* **t* **r* *r t** *****r**t *r*** ***t*r*,
THEN the Machine That Goes *ping* shall go *ping*.

IF AND ONLY IF today was a date with zero pf two different prime factors
THEN the Machine That Goes "ping" shall go "ping"

Jammer
John-Martin Lotz
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 08:12:16 +0000
From: "Matt" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: acrobot

snowgod [who else] wrote:
> #current
> #thanks

snowgod!!!

You're _still_ infected, and you're transmitting it all over the 
place! You'd better get cured soon, or we're all in _deep_ trouble

Bascule
Hoping for a vaccine

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 27 Jan 1997 23:15:36 -0900
From: Phil Ackley <[email-masked]>
Subject: re: ac**bot 

>#current
>#thanks

AAAARRRRRGGGHHH!

It is a plague.  And you know, it won't be cured until ThinMan, among
others, fulfills his prescription.  Of course, I'm already infected, so it
won't do a whole bunch of good to call one on me :)

snowgod
apologetic and infected

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 03:10:46 -0500
From: Dan Knapp (A.K.A. TheWiz) <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Machine: AARRGGHH!! 

> > > IF AND ONLY IF today has a date with more or two different prime factors,
> > > THEN the Machine That Goes *ping* shall go *ping*.
> >
> > Obviously my wrong post didn't bother Malenkai too much.  This guess is
> > much, much farther from the truth than my post of the truth with the r's
> > filled in was from what I should have posted.
> At least its the first guess that *could* have been right.  Nothing in
> rule says anything about grammer, and none of the previous guesses
> had a chance of representing a legal truth.

  OK, true enough.  Still, it (like, I suppose, all the others - *sigh*)
didn't really specify precisely what the conditions were - "more or two"
would make considerably more sense the other way around.  If I'm right, and
I'm only guessing in the dark, mind, this pushes the definition of a
"truth" slightly, I'd say, though still it's quite backed-up by game
custom.  For those who haven't already used their guess, I have a track
record of saying things that only misdirect in any case.  That, now, is all
I have to say on that topic, at least until we have a new truth.

- -Red Barn
Not meaning to act superior; sorry if it comes off that way.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 00:10:55 -0800
From: [email-masked] (John Martin Lotz)
Subject: Acka:  I've found a Tranparent gif maker

I've found one, so if people want graphic letters 
I can do it.

Jammer
John-Martin Lotz
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 00:09:31 -0800
From: [email-masked] (John Martin Lotz)
Subject: Acka Arggggggh correction

Anyway...

Red Barn named t as the magic letter.
Red Barn -15 magic letter t

Yes, I recall there being several t's (and one additional r) in the truth:

IF AND ONLY IF today *** * **t* **t* **r* *r t** *****r**t *r*** ***t*r*,
THEN the Machine That Goes *ping* shall go *ping*.

IF AND ONLY IF today was a date with zero or two different prime factors
THEN the Machine That Goes "ping" shall go "ping"

John-Martin Lotz
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 27 Jan 1997 23:23:02 -0900
From: Phil Ackley <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Wall Submission 

Vote for Absurdity!  Support Recursive Loops!

snowgod

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 02:28:23 -0600 (CST)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <devjoe>
Subject: Re: Acka: Machine: AARRGGHH!!

Jammer guessed:
> IF AND ONLY IF today was a date with zero pf two different prime factors
> THEN the Machine That Goes "ping" shall go "ping"

It looks like everybody is having a bad day.  This is still wrong!
Sorry if this ridicule is lame; this is the 7th one I had to do this
term as Scholar, and I'm out of original, interesting ridicules.

The web page now has a list of the players who have already guessed wrong,
to help me make sure I don't respond to an illegal guess by a player
who has already guessed this truth wrong.

Jammer posted something else shortly after this, but the Machine rule
prohibits anyone from guessing between Jammer's post quoted above and
this post in response to it, and they prohibit Jammer from guessing
at this truth again now that he's been ridiculed.  It was not a
legal guess according to the rules, so I will not be commenting on it.

/dev/joe
Scholar

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 00:22:48 -0800
From: [email-masked] (John Martin Lotz)
Subject: Re: Acka: Wall Submission

Vote for Absurdity!  Support Recursive Loops!

snowgod

Done!

Jammer
AKAJohn-Martin Lotz
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 08:33:44 -0500
From: "Bollinger, John C." <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka:Scroll of Crumble Auction

Jammer wrote:

>550
>+55
>------
>610
>
>Jammer 
>Mathematically
                   ^
     Challenged ---|

ThinMan

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 08:34:54 -0500
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: About Undead

Bollinger, John C. wrote:

> I no longer have the material handy, although I might be able to
> find it on a backup tape.  Otherwise, the most recent information
> available previous to your administration will be on the last
> Financier's report that I submitted.

Actually, IdiotBoy preceeded me, but he was Financier for a short
time, so it may not of mattered.  I remember asking for it back then,
but never receiving it.  In any case, that log may have had the
money, but perhaps not the entities.

Regardless of what happened, or whatever, the reality is that some of
the data is lost, and probably not recoverable.  I guess I'm more curious
about the following:

1) Would anyone mind if we scrapped all extant undead and started from
scratch?  One of the points of the undead was to prevent a quit-join 
loophole, and that really won't be an issue with any of the currrent
undead.  Furtheremore, there are plenty of old players without undead
anyway.

2) Afterwords, someone volunteers for the office of Grave-Harfer to
track undead.  I simply do not have the time.

To the extent that it was my fault that the undead before I took over were
not tracked, I apologize.  If someone can reconstruct the undead from
before I took over as financier, that would be fine too.

Malenkai

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 08:50:44 -0500
From: "Bollinger, John C." <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka

>  A bit of experimentation will reveal that it is possible to separate
>groups of Ackapennies with consecutive serial numbers from the pile, in
>groups of 100.  If this is done, the following things occur:
>  1.  This trinket is destroyed.
>  2.  The Ackapennies which constituted it/them are broken up into groups
>which
>    are of size 100, by any means which is desired by the player performing
>the
>    action of separation.
>  3.  New trinkets, one for each group formed in the previous step, and
>composed
>    of the Ackapennies contained in that group, are created.

[etc.]

>  If you argue that this is illegal - that is, that trinkets cannot
>manipulate themselves - I refer you to Malenkai's (I think it was his)
>chest, which can contain other entities and cannot be opened without the
>appropriate key.

Trinkets, indeed, cannot manipulate themselves.  Malenkai's trinket
description has no force, either, but he backup it up with a treasure
hunt which simulates the effect written in the description.

ThinMan

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 08:53:49 -0500
From: "Bollinger, John C." <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka:Scroll of Crumble Auction

Red Barn wrote:

>  You're a bit late, as my last bid was for A$610; nobody's topped that,
>yet.  You wouldn't be trying to usurp my title again, now would you? :)

Actually, your last _legal_ bid was A$605.  The A$610, prompted
by Jammer's comments, did not exceed A$605 by 10% and was thus
not valid.

ThinMan

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 08:59:36 -0500
From: "Bollinger, John C." <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka:  bot

Mohammed wrote:

>I'm sure you've all been awaiting this moment with bated breath, or 
>something.

In case anyone has been waiting with baited breath instead -- just
write me, and I'll send a breath mint.

ThinMan

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 09:07:37 -0500
From: "Bollinger, John C." <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka: Machine: AARRGGHH!!

Cheesy and cheap as it might be, I think that the machine's truth must
be:

IF AND ONLY IF today has a date with zero or two different prime
factors, THEN the Machine That Goes *ping* shall go *ping*.

ThinMan

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 08:07:23 -0600 (CST)
From: Guy Fawkes <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka Arggggggh correction

On Tue, 28 Jan 1997, John Martin Lotz wrote:

Sorry, Jammer, but I gots to try...

> IF AND ONLY IF today has a date with zero or two different prime factors,
> THEN the Machine That Goes *ping* shall go *ping*.

Guy Fawkes

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 08:10:36 -0600 (CST)
From: Guy Fawkes <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka:  I've found a Tranparent gif maker

Did you download from somewhere we could access?  If so, could you please 
tell us where?

Guy Fawkes

On Tue, 28 Jan 1997, John Martin Lotz wrote:

> I've found one, so if people want graphic letters 
> I can do it.
> 
> Jammer
> John-Martin Lotz
> [email-masked]

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 09:27:41 -0500
From: "Bollinger, John C." <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka Arggggggh correction

>Sorry, Jammer, but I gots to try...
>
>> IF AND ONLY IF today has a date with zero or two different prime factors,
>> THEN the Machine That Goes *ping* shall go *ping*.
>
>Guy Fawkes

Oh no!  Not again!  Actually, I think I beat Guy Fawkes by about two
minutes, but we'll have to see first whether we are right.

ThinMan
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 09:35:12 -0500
From: "Bollinger, John C." <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka Arggggggh correction

I wrote:

>Oh no!  Not again!  Actually, I think I beat Guy Fawkes by about two
>minutes, but we'll have to see first whether we are right.

I think I have to take that back.  The timestamps from the originating
machines are within 15 seconds of each other, with Guy's being first.
Does someone still have the URL of the atomic clock server?

ThinMan
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 10:36:28 -0500 (EST)
From: mr cwm <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Proposal 1686

On Mon, 27 Jan 1997, Guy Fawkes wrote:

>
>In a huge ruleset, both procedures are unnecessary, and I believe Dueling 
>is the superior one.  A PM allows someone to safely accuse someone 
>without incurring any risk of their own (except perhaps a counter-PM).  
>Dueling, on the other hand, requires the challenger to undertake a risk, 
>and thanks to Untouchability, the problem of Counter-Duels is much less.
>
>Both procedures are fairly light-hearted; I think Duels are simply more 
>fun for more participants and observers.
>

Politeness Moons have not always seemed so light-hearted to me.  I think
Duels are suitable for most occasions, but I'd prefer the Politeness Moon
to remain as a reminder that we should actually be polite in our
interactions with each other.  

- -mr cwm 

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 11:06:40 -0500 (EST)
From: mr cwm <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: is

is (mr cwm, publisher, etc.)

In a transparent attempt to avoid going belly-up, is reports that is
reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports
that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is
reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports
that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is
reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports
that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is
reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports
that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is
reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports
that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is
reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports
that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is
reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports
that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is
reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports
that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is
reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports
that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is
reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports
that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is
reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports
that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is
reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports
that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is
reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports
that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is
reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports
that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is
reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports
that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is
reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports
that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is
reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports
that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is
reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports
that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is
reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports
that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is
reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports
that is reports that is reports that is reports that is reports that is
has published a ludicrous self-referential issue today.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 10:28:10 -0600 (CST)
From: Guy Fawkes <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka Arggggggh correction

In the Hubert case (CFJ 324), it was ruled that in the absence of 
publically posted correction factors, Acka events occur when the 
timestamp said they occurred.  I find the reasoning used here very 
interesting, and also sound.

After the Hubert case, I posted that the machine I had used that night 
did indeed to appear to be a couple of minutes slow, but I made the point 
that this was NOT to be construed as a correction factor for my email, as 
that particular message had been timed off a local computer's internal 
clock, unlike the vast majority of my mail, which is timed from uiuc's 
mail server, which when on-line, is accurate within a couple of seconds 
to the atomic clock server, as far as I can tell.

After the Hubert case, you did publically post that your computer was 
accurate to the atomic clock server within three seconds.

Examining the headers of your messages, I believe it is very likely 
that whatever computer you sent off your guess of the truth from is a 
couple of minutes fast, as it arrived at wilma BEFORE you sent it off.  
If you wish to publically make a correction factor, feel free to do so, 
but I do not believe it would be retroactive.

If the precedent of CFJ 324 holds true, since neither of us had a 
correction factor in place at the time of the guesses, we must use their 
timestamps the actual times, my guess occurring about 14 seconds before 
yours.

Guy Fawkes

PS  Keep in mind that if our guess is wrong, your guess doesn't count for 
ridicule because /dev/joe hadn't responded to mine yet, and you can still 
try again.

On Tue, 28 Jan 1997, Bollinger, John C. wrote:

> >Oh no!  Not again!  Actually, I think I beat Guy Fawkes by about two
> >minutes, but we'll have to see first whether we are right.
> 
> I think I have to take that back.  The timestamps from the originating
> machines are within 15 seconds of each other, with Guy's being first.
> Does someone still have the URL of the atomic clock server?

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 10:41:11 -0600 (CST)
From: Guy Fawkes <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Zimbabwe

On Mon, 27 Jan 1997, Malenkai wrote:

> I am going to Zimbabwe, and playing the Chartreuse Bagpipes while
> doing so.
> 
> Malenkai

Are you treasure hunting, or is this a satire of how absurd /dev/joe 
supposed profundity about quietly voting for a mongoose was.

Guy Fawkes

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 09:02:53 -0800
From: [email-masked] (John Martin Lotz)
Subject: Re: Acka:  I've found a Tranparent gif maker

Did you download from somewhere we could access?  If so, could you please 
tell us where?

Guy Fawkes

On Tue, 28 Jan 1997, John Martin Lotz wrote:

> I've found one, so if people want graphic letters 
> I can do it.
> 
I found it at http://tucows.iwebstudio.com/index.html, they have a 
variety oftypes of software available.

Jammer
who did guess first
John-Martin Lotz
[email-masked]

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 11:26:35 PST
From: [email-masked]
Subject: Acka: Resign

This is the last message I will be able to send on thius Juno account. 
The company has pulled their 900 access,  and my phone service is
antiquated enough that I can't make non-800 calls without  the
assistance of an operator.  This substantively affects my ability to
make modem connections and send and recieve mail.  For this reason,  and
this reason alone,  I must resign from Ackanomic immediately.  I am sorry
to leave so many issues unresolved,  and promise to return as soon as my
circumstances change (either I get a new address,  or the phone company
upgrades their equipment,  you guess which will come first).  Please
remove me from all mailing lists until such time as I can reclaim my
rightful place in the Harfiest of games.

Habeous Corpus
Ed Graham

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 09:40:55 -0800 (PST)
From: Brian Raiter <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Proposal 1686

> In a huge ruleset, both procedures are unnecessary, and I believe
> Dueling is the superior one.  A PM allows someone to safely accuse
> someone without incurring any risk of their own (except perhaps a
> counter-PM).  Dueling, on the other hand, requires the challenger to
> undertake a risk, and thanks to Untouchability, the problem of
> Counter-Duels is much less.

No disrespect to our esteemed Guy Fawkes, but ...

As our Historian, I'm afraid I must speak out against the proposal to
repeal the Politeness Moon.

While I applaud Guy Fawkes' general wish to trim the rule set of fat
and redundancy, I want to remind everyone that the Politeness Moon is:

* the 14th proposal to be submitted,
* the third proposal to be accepted, and
* the second oldest rule still in existence (barring the IRS).

In addition, the Politeness Moon eventually became the template for
the general concept of Hearings.

While Duels can certainly serve as replacements for Politeness Moons,
they are not the same thing, and Politeness Moons have earned their
place in Ackanomic.

Because of the recent Reorganizations, we now have a Ruleset that has
almost completely forgotten its history. I can understand why, in such
an environment, players might want to toss out what they now see as
outdated and unnecessary. I would humbly ask all of you to not be
quite so efficient at it.

breadbox
Historian

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 11:53:30 -0600 (CST)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <devjoe>
Subject: Acka: Machine Resolution

Two different players guessed:
> IF AND ONLY IF today has a date with zero or two different prime
> factors, THEN the Machine That Goes *ping* shall go *ping*.

This is correct. (Oh, yeah, praise...)  Only a really alert player would
see to correct the "was" to "has" from Jammer's second guess.
Congratulations, ... (who?)

Hmm, it seems we have another Hubert.
Here are the relevant headers:

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 08:07:23 -0600 (CST)
From: Guy Fawkes <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka Arggggggh correction

From: "Bollinger, John C." <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka: Machine: AARRGGHH!!
Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 09:07:37 -0500

From this, it can clearly be seen that ThinMan's computer's clock is
fast by about two minutes, so his was actually the first post received
and he is the next Scholar of *ping*.

Congratulations ThinMan, and I hereby present you with the
Pedestal of *ping* for the Machine to rest on as you study it.
I am also giving Swann A$5; he was the only player to make an
incorrect guess after I posted the truth with R's incorrectly filled
in and before my ARRRGHH post.

/dev/joe

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 12:12:02 -0600 (CST)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <devjoe>
Subject: Re: Acka: Resign

> This is the last message I will be able to send on thius Juno account. 
> The company has pulled their 900 access,  and my phone service is
> antiquated enough that I can't make non-800 calls without  the
> assistance of an operator.  This substantively affects my ability to
> make modem connections and send and recieve mail.  For this reason,  and
> this reason alone,  I must resign from Ackanomic immediately. 
> Habeous Corpus
> Ed Graham

Ouch, it's a sad day to see the departure of a player who has been with us
so long for such a reason as this.

I nominate Habeous Corpus for the Hall of Elders.

/dev/joe

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 13:17:29 -0500
From: "Bollinger, John C." <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka: Resign

>I nominate Habeous Corpus for the Hall of Elders.

I also nominate Habeous Corpus for the Hall of Elders.

ThinMan

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 12:23:03 -0600 (CST)
From: Guy Fawkes <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka: Resign

I also nominate Habeous Corpus for the Hall of Elders.

Guy Fawkes

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 20:27:47 +0200 (EET)
From: Uri Bruck <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka: Resign - Habous Corpus

On Tue, 28 Jan 1997, Guy Fawkes wrote:

> 
> I also nominate Habeous Corpus for the Hall of Elders.
> 
> Guy Fawkes
> 
I join the nomination of Habeous Corpus for the Hall of Elders

Niccolo Flychuck

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 13:28:39 -0500 (EST)
From: mr cwm <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: Acka: Resign

On Tue, 28 Jan 1997, ThinMan wrote:

>
>>I nominate Habeous Corpus for the Hall of Elders.
>
>I also nominate Habeous Corpus for the Hall of Elders.
>

I second (third?) these nominations.  (How many do we need?)

- -mr cwm

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 28 Jan 1997 10:38:30 -0800 (PST)
From: Brian Raiter <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Samizdat Publication

INSANITY SWEEPS ACKANOMIA!

[Associated Samizdat] Players across
the land today were seen performing
strange, irrational acts. Though some
write it off as harmless, others
suspect an epidemic and fear for their
own sanity.

/dev/joe, Ackanomic's Scorekeeper,
respected member of the Vulcan party,
and a player known to all as being a
paragon of rationality, visited Guy
Fawkes' Tower of Futility today, where
he apparently spent hours staring at
the statues. He then made a public
announcement that he was hearing
voices in his head.

Almost immediately after this,
Malenkai, another respected member of
the community and holder of many
Functional Offices, admitted to
everyone that he was hallucinating. He
spoke of travelling great distances,
and of creating loud music, and
described vivid, inappropriate
colors. Then, he announced to everyone
present that he was now "the Prophet
of the Golden Frog".

As if this weren't bad enough, he then
announced that he was going to start
work on building a mind control
laser. He also proceeded to submit a
long, rambling proposal, with trinkets
attached as bribes, that had no effect
other than to give himself an
Automatic Sculpture.

All this took place, of course, after
/dev/joe and Malenkai faced off in
their recent Duel. Nobody could quite
discern the true nature of their
disagreement, for they concealed it by
speaking in nonsense syllables. It is
now believed by some that this was the
first sign of their mental derangement.

Ackazen Bascule, who has of yet
exhibited no unusual behaviors
himself, seemed unconcerned, and wrote
it off as "treasure fever".

Nonetheless, others, who choose to
remain nameless, are concerned for the
safety of our Functional Officers,
and, by extension, the whole of
Ackanomia. This group of Ackazens
grows as more evidence arrives that
something is wrong.

Since the outbreak's beginning,
/dev/joe has admitted to misreporting
the truth of the Machine that goes
*ping*, and Malenkai has claimed to
have either lost old records of
deceased players, or to have NEVER HAD
THEM. Such failures are practically
unheard of from either of these
players, much less both at the same
time, and the rest of Ackanomia is
beginning to wonder how much can be
chalked up to coincidence.

Other signs of bizarre activity can be
seen at the Financial Market, where a
Scroll of Crumble is currently being
auctioned off at over 1000% percent
its estimated material value, and in
the public fora, where an
unprecedented number of players are
showing signs of snowgod's disease, or
"afflicte de snowgod".

------------------------------

End of Ackanomic Digest V1 #487
*******************************