Subject: Ackanomic Digest V1 #262
From: [email-masked] (Ackanomic Digest)
To: ackanomic-digest

Ackanomic Digest     Thursday, September 26 1996     Volume 01 : Number 262

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 96 14:05:18 EDT 
From: [email-masked] ()
Subject: Ackanomic: Prop 1250 Fails

Here are the voting results for : 1250
  Proposal 1250 - Wed Sep 18 10:51:45 EDT 1996
  Enlightement is the Dead Gnome of Heresy
  mr cwm  (Eric Murray)

Quorum met : 22 eligible voters -- 18 players cast votes

8 YES votes   11 NO votes   0 PRESENT votes
Proposal FAILS

mr cwm loses 7 points.  8 -> 1

8 YES votes:  3 point each
  Robin Hood                                    8 -> 11           
  Malenkai               FUN                   11 -> 14           
  ThinMan                Vulcan                12 -> 15           
  Bascule                FUN                   18 -> 21           
  snowgod                (None Yet)            44 -> 47           
  Guy Fawkes             (None Yet)            30 -> 33           
  fnord                                        18 -> 21           
  mr cwm                 (None Yet)             1 -> 4            

11 NO votes:  
  Brinjal                                     =  15               
  Niccolo Flychuck       Vulcan               =  22               
  Bash                   Underworld           =  15               
  Habeous Corpus                              =  17               
  /dev/joe               Vulcan               =  12               
  Techno                 Underworld           =   6               
  IdiotBoy               Underworld           =  21               
  Underworld Unity vote                        =   0               
  breadbox                                    =   9               
  Uncle Sam              Underworld           =  21               
  Wayne                  Underworld           =  17               

0 PRESENT votes:

4 ABSTENTIONS:
  Calvin N Hobbes        FUN                  
  this is not a name     (None Yet)           
  skinny                                      
  Mohammed                                    

Players on Vacation who did not vote:
  fon                                         
  Robert Sevin                                
  Pascal                                      

New players who are not active:
  Dagny                                       
  Tim                                         

====================================================
Wayne, your friendly Tabulator
====================================================

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 96 14:05:32 EDT 
From: [email-masked] ()
Subject: Ackanomic: Prop 1251 Fails

Here are the voting results for : 1251
  Proposal 1251 - Wed Sep 18 10:52:01 EDT 1996
  Creative Cranium Copyright
  Guy Fawkes  (Robert Shimmin)

Quorum met : 22 eligible voters -- 18 players cast votes

10 YES votes   9 NO votes   0 PRESENT votes
Proposal FAILS

Guy Fawkes loses 7 points.  33 -> 26

10 YES votes:  3 point each
  Robin Hood                                   11 -> 14           
  Malenkai               FUN                   14 -> 17           
  Brinjal                                      15 -> 18           
  ThinMan                Vulcan                15 -> 18           
  Bascule                FUN                   21 -> 24           
  snowgod                (None Yet)            47 -> 50           
  Habeous Corpus                               17 -> 20           
  /dev/joe               Vulcan                12 -> 15           
  Guy Fawkes             (None Yet)            26 -> 29           
  fnord                                        21 -> 24           

9 NO votes:  
  Niccolo Flychuck       Vulcan               =  22               
  Bash                   Underworld           =  15               
  Techno                 Underworld           =   6               
  IdiotBoy               Underworld           =  21               
  Underworld Unity vote                        =   0               
  breadbox                                    =   9               
  Uncle Sam              Underworld           =  21               
  mr cwm                 (None Yet)           =   4               
  Wayne                  Underworld           =  17               

0 PRESENT votes:

4 ABSTENTIONS:
  this is not a name     (None Yet)           
  Calvin N Hobbes        FUN                  
  skinny                                      
  Mohammed                                    

Players on Vacation who did not vote:
  fon                                         
  Robert Sevin                                
  Pascal                                      

New players who are not active:
  Tim                                         
  Dagny                                       

====================================================
Wayne, your friendly Tabulator
====================================================

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 96 14:06:15 EDT 
From: [email-masked] ()
Subject: Ackanomic: Prop 1252 Fails

Here are the voting results for : 1252
  Proposal 1252 - Wed Sep 18 11:20:59 EDT 1996
  Bomb Shelter
  Malenkai  (Randy Hall)

Quorum met : 22 eligible voters -- 18 players cast votes

10 YES votes   10 NO votes   0 PRESENT votes
Proposal FAILS

Malenkai loses 7 points.  17 -> 10

10 YES votes:  3 point each
  Robin Hood                                   14 -> 17           
  Malenkai               FUN                   10 -> 13           
  Brinjal                                      18 -> 21           
  ThinMan                Vulcan                18 -> 21           
  Bascule                FUN                   24 -> 27           
  snowgod                (None Yet)            50 -> 53           
  Guy Fawkes             (None Yet)            29 -> 32           
  fnord                                        24 -> 27           
  Tammany                                     =   0               
  mr cwm                 (None Yet)             4 -> 7            

10 NO votes:  
  Niccolo Flychuck       Vulcan               =  22               
  Bash                   Underworld           =  15               
  Habeous Corpus                              =  20               
  /dev/joe               Vulcan               =  15               
  Techno                 Underworld           =   6               
  IdiotBoy               Underworld           =  21               
  Underworld Unity vote                        =   0               
  breadbox                                    =   9               
  Uncle Sam              Underworld           =  21               
  Wayne                  Underworld           =  17               

0 PRESENT votes:

4 ABSTENTIONS:
  Calvin N Hobbes        FUN                  
  this is not a name     (None Yet)           
  skinny                                      
  Mohammed                                    

Players on Vacation who did not vote:
  fon                                         
  Robert Sevin                                
  Pascal                                      

New players who are not active:
  Dagny                                       
  Tim                                         
- -------------------------
The Tammany was bribed by Malenkai for A$5

====================================================
Wayne, your friendly Tabulator
====================================================

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 96 14:07:48 EDT 
From: [email-masked] ()
Subject: Ackanomic: Prop 1253 Passes

Here are the voting results for : 1253
  Proposal 1253 - Wed Sep 18 11:21:13 EDT 1996
  Tornado
  Malenkai  (Randy Hall)

Quorum met : 22 eligible voters -- 18 players cast votes

16 YES votes   4 NO votes   0 PRESENT votes
Proposal PASSES

Malenkai gains 10 points.  17 -> 27

16 YES votes:  
  Robin Hood                                  =  14               
  Malenkai               FUN                  =  27               
  Brinjal                                     =  18               
  ThinMan                Vulcan               =  18               
  Bascule                FUN                  =  24               
  Bash                   Underworld           =  15               
  snowgod                (None Yet)           =  50               
  Techno                 Underworld           =   6               
  Guy Fawkes             (None Yet)           =  29               
  IdiotBoy               Underworld           =  21               
  fnord                                       =  24               
  Tammany                                     =   0               
  Underworld Unity vote                        =   0               
  Uncle Sam              Underworld           =  21               
  mr cwm                 (None Yet)           =   4               
  Wayne                  Underworld           =  17               

4 NO votes:  3 points each
  Niccolo Flychuck       Vulcan                22 -> 25           
  Habeous Corpus                               20 -> 23           
  /dev/joe               Vulcan                15 -> 18           
  breadbox                                      9 -> 12           

0 PRESENT votes:

4 ABSTENTIONS:
  Calvin N Hobbes        FUN                  
  this is not a name     (None Yet)           
  skinny                                      
  Mohammed                                    

Players on Vacation who did not vote:
  fon                                         
  Robert Sevin                                
  Pascal                                      

New players who are not active:
  Dagny                                       
  Tim                                         
==================================
Malenkai spend A$5 bribing the Tammany.

====================================================
Wayne, your friendly Tabulator
====================================================
Proposal 1253 - Wed Sep 18 11:21:13 EDT 1996
Tornado
Malenkai  (Randy Hall)

Create a new rule which reads:

"A Tornado shall sweep though Acka at the time of the Summer Solstice,
Winter Solstice, Vernal Equinox, and Autumnal Equinox.  All Tornadoes
are Protected.

Whenever a Tornado sweeps through Acka, the scores of all non-Sheltered
players shall be randomly reassigned among the non-Sheltered players.
In other words, the score of each non-Sheltered player is placed in
a pool, all non-Sheltered player's scores are set to 0, a random
score is chosen from the above pool, without replacement, and added to
the score of a randomly chosen (without replacement) non-Sheltered player,
until the pool is exausted.  ("without replacement" means the randomly
chosen entity may not be re-chosen for the duration of a single instance
of this process, once it has been randomly chosen).  If there are no
non-Sheltered players, the Tornado has no effect.  Sheltered players
are unaffected, in any case.

The Officer in charge of random things is responsible for carrying out
this procedure, when the Rules call for it to occur.

Players in the Ackanomic Afterlife and Gaol are Sheltered.  If a Bomb
Shelter exists, all players are Sheltered, regardless of their Location.

A Bomb Shelter may only be created by methods specified in the Rules.
Players may only become Sheltered by methods specified in the Rules.

The Rules may specify other ways or times that a Tornado sweeps through
Acka.

{{all players become non-Sheltered.  All Bomb Shelters are destroyed.}}"

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 96 14:08:13 EDT 
From: [email-masked] ()
Subject: Ackanomic: Prop 1254 Fails

Here are the voting results for : 1254
  Proposal 1254 - Wed Sep 18 23:37:28 EDT 1996
  Sanity in triggered scoring
  /dev/joe  (Joseph DeVincentis)

Quorum met : 22 eligible voters -- 15 players cast votes

9 YES votes   8 NO votes   0 PRESENT votes
Proposal FAILS

/dev/joe loses 7 points.  18 -> 11

9 YES votes:  3 point each
  Brinjal                                      18 -> 21           
  ThinMan                Vulcan                18 -> 21           
  Niccolo Flychuck       Vulcan                25 -> 28           
  snowgod                (None Yet)            50 -> 53           
  Habeous Corpus                               23 -> 26           
  Vulcan Unity vote                           =   0               
  /dev/joe               Vulcan                11 -> 14           
  breadbox                                     12 -> 15           
  mr cwm                 (None Yet)             4 -> 7            

8 NO votes:  
  Malenkai               FUN                  =  27               
  Bash                   Underworld           =  15               
  Techno                 Underworld           =   6               
  Guy Fawkes             (None Yet)           =  29               
  IdiotBoy               Underworld           =  21               
  Underworld Unity vote                        =   0               
  Uncle Sam              Underworld           =  21               
  Wayne                  Underworld           =  17               

0 PRESENT votes:

7 ABSTENTIONS:
  Robin Hood                                  
  Bascule                FUN                  
  this is not a name     (None Yet)           
  Calvin N Hobbes        FUN                  
  fnord                                       
  skinny                                      
  Mohammed                                    

Players on Vacation who did not vote:
  fon                                         
  Robert Sevin                                
  Pascal                                      

New players who are not active:
  Tim                                         
  Dagny                                       

====================================================
Wayne, your friendly Tabulator
====================================================

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 96 14:08:59 EDT 
From: [email-masked] ()
Subject: Ackanomic: Prop 1255 Fails

Here are the voting results for : 1255
  Proposal 1255 - Wed Sep 18 23:37:41 EDT 1996
  No Double Jepoardy
  Guy Fawkes  (Robert Shimmin)

Quorum met : 22 eligible voters -- 15 players cast votes

11 YES votes   6 NO votes   0 PRESENT votes
Proposal FAILS

Guy Fawkes loses 7 points.  29 -> 22

11 YES votes:  3 point each
  Malenkai               FUN                   27 -> 30           
  Brinjal                                      21 -> 24           
  ThinMan                Vulcan                21 -> 24           
  Niccolo Flychuck       Vulcan                28 -> 31           
  snowgod                (None Yet)            53 -> 56           
  Habeous Corpus                               26 -> 29           
  Vulcan Unity vote                           =   0               
  /dev/joe               Vulcan                14 -> 17           
  Guy Fawkes             (None Yet)            22 -> 25           
  breadbox                                     15 -> 18           
  mr cwm                 (None Yet)             7 -> 10           

6 NO votes:  
  Bash                   Underworld           =  15               
  Techno                 Underworld           =   6               
  IdiotBoy               Underworld           =  21               
  Underworld Unity vote                        =   0               
  Uncle Sam              Underworld           =  21               
  Wayne                  Underworld           =  17               

0 PRESENT votes:

7 ABSTENTIONS:
  Robin Hood                                  
  Bascule                FUN                  
  Calvin N Hobbes        FUN                  
  this is not a name     (None Yet)           
  fnord                                       
  skinny                                      
  Mohammed                                    

Players on Vacation who did not vote:
  fon                                         
  Robert Sevin                                
  Pascal                                      

New players who are not active:
  Dagny                                       
  Tim                                         

====================================================
Wayne, your friendly Tabulator
====================================================

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 96 14:11:07 EDT 
From: [email-masked] ()
Subject: Ackanomic: Prop 1256 Fails

Here are the voting results for : 1256
  Proposal 1256 - Thu Sep 19 12:04:22 EDT 1996
  Possessions of the Parties
  IdiotBoy  (Matt Miller)

Quorum met : 22 eligible voters -- 15 players cast votes

10 YES votes   6 NO votes   0 PRESENT votes
Proposal FAILS

IdiotBoy loses 7 points.  21 -> 14

10 YES votes:  3 point each
  Brinjal                                      24 -> 27           
  ThinMan                Vulcan                24 -> 27           
  Bash                   Underworld            15 -> 18           
  snowgod                (None Yet)            56 -> 59           
  Techno                 Underworld             6 -> 9            
  IdiotBoy               Underworld            14 -> 17           
  Underworld Unity vote                        =   0               
  mr cwm                 (None Yet)            10 -> 13           
  Uncle Sam              Underworld            21 -> 24           
  Wayne                  Underworld            17 -> 20           

6 NO votes:  
  Malenkai               FUN                  =  30               
  Niccolo Flychuck       Vulcan               =  31               
  Habeous Corpus                              =  29               
  /dev/joe               Vulcan               =  17               
  Guy Fawkes             (None Yet)           =  25               
  breadbox                                    =  18               

0 PRESENT votes:

7 ABSTENTIONS:
  Robin Hood                                  
  Bascule                FUN                  
  this is not a name     (None Yet)           
  Calvin N Hobbes        FUN                  
  fnord                                       
  skinny                                      
  Mohammed                                    

Players on Vacation who did not vote:
  fon                                         
  Robert Sevin                                
  Pascal                                      

New players who are not active:
  Tim                                         
  Dagny                                       

====================================================
Wayne, your friendly Tabulator
====================================================

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 96 14:11:34 EDT 
From: [email-masked] ()
Subject: Ackanomic: Prop 1257 Fails

Here are the voting results for : 1257
  Proposal 1257 - Thu Sep 19 12:05:09 EDT 1996
  Refund I
  IdiotBoy  (Matt Miller)

Quorum met : 22 eligible voters -- 15 players cast votes

7 YES votes   9 NO votes   0 PRESENT votes
Proposal FAILS

IdiotBoy loses 7 points.  17 -> 10

7 YES votes:  3 point each
  Bash                   Underworld            18 -> 21           
  /dev/joe               Vulcan                17 -> 20           
  Techno                 Underworld             9 -> 12           
  IdiotBoy               Underworld            10 -> 13           
  Underworld Unity vote                        =   0               
  Uncle Sam              Underworld            24 -> 27           
  Wayne                  Underworld            20 -> 23           

9 NO votes:  
  Malenkai               FUN                  =  30               
  Brinjal                                     =  27               
  ThinMan                Vulcan               =  27               
  Niccolo Flychuck       Vulcan               =  31               
  snowgod                (None Yet)           =  59               
  Habeous Corpus                              =  29               
  Guy Fawkes             (None Yet)           =  25               
  breadbox                                    =  18               
  mr cwm                 (None Yet)           =  13               

0 PRESENT votes:

7 ABSTENTIONS:
  Robin Hood                                  
  Bascule                FUN                  
  Calvin N Hobbes        FUN                  
  this is not a name     (None Yet)           
  fnord                                       
  skinny                                      
  Mohammed                                    

Players on Vacation who did not vote:
  fon                                         
  Robert Sevin                                
  Pascal                                      

New players who are not active:
  Dagny                                       
  Tim                                         

====================================================
Wayne, your friendly Tabulator
====================================================

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 96 14:12:19 EDT 
From: [email-masked] ()
Subject: Ackanomic: Prop 1258 Fails

Here are the voting results for : 1258
  Proposal 1258 - Thu Sep 19 12:05:28 EDT 1996
  Refund II
  IdiotBoy  (Matt Miller)

Quorum met : 22 eligible voters -- 15 players cast votes

8 YES votes   9 NO votes   0 PRESENT votes
Proposal FAILS

IdiotBoy loses 7 points.  13 -> 6

8 YES votes:  3 point each
  Malenkai               FUN                   30 -> 33           
  Bash                   Underworld            21 -> 24           
  Techno                 Underworld            12 -> 15           
  Guy Fawkes             (None Yet)            25 -> 28           
  IdiotBoy               Underworld             6 -> 9            
  Underworld Unity vote                        =   0               
  Uncle Sam              Underworld            27 -> 30           
  Wayne                  Underworld            23 -> 26           

9 NO votes:  
  Brinjal                                     =  27               
  ThinMan                Vulcan               =  27               
  Niccolo Flychuck       Vulcan               =  31               
  snowgod                (None Yet)           =  59               
  Habeous Corpus                              =  29               
  Vulcan Unity vote                           =   0               
  /dev/joe               Vulcan               =  20               
  breadbox                                    =  18               
  mr cwm                 (None Yet)           =  13               

0 PRESENT votes:

7 ABSTENTIONS:
  Robin Hood                                  
  Bascule                FUN                  
  this is not a name     (None Yet)           
  Calvin N Hobbes        FUN                  
  fnord                                       
  skinny                                      
  Mohammed                                    

Players on Vacation who did not vote:
  fon                                         
  Robert Sevin                                
  Pascal                                      

New players who are not active:
  Tim                                         
  Dagny                                       

====================================================
Wayne, your friendly Tabulator
====================================================

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 96 14:12:47 EDT 
From: [email-masked] ()
Subject: Ackanomic: Prop 1259 Fails

Here are the voting results for : 1259
  Proposal 1259 - Thu Sep 19 12:06:18 EDT 1996
  No Monopoly
  IdiotBoy  (Matt Miller)

Quorum met : 22 eligible voters -- 15 players cast votes

8 YES votes   9 NO votes   0 PRESENT votes
Proposal FAILS

IdiotBoy loses 7 points.  9 -> 2

8 YES votes:  3 point each
  Malenkai               FUN                   33 -> 36           
  Bash                   Underworld            24 -> 27           
  Techno                 Underworld            15 -> 18           
  Guy Fawkes             (None Yet)            28 -> 31           
  IdiotBoy               Underworld             2 -> 5            
  Underworld Unity vote                        =   0               
  Uncle Sam              Underworld            30 -> 33           
  Wayne                  Underworld            26 -> 29           

9 NO votes:  
  Brinjal                                     =  27               
  ThinMan                Vulcan               =  27               
  Niccolo Flychuck       Vulcan               =  31               
  snowgod                (None Yet)           =  59               
  Habeous Corpus                              =  29               
  Vulcan Unity vote                           =   0               
  /dev/joe               Vulcan               =  20               
  breadbox                                    =  18               
  mr cwm                 (None Yet)           =  13               

0 PRESENT votes:

7 ABSTENTIONS:
  Robin Hood                                  
  Bascule                FUN                  
  Calvin N Hobbes        FUN                  
  this is not a name     (None Yet)           
  fnord                                       
  skinny                                      
  Mohammed                                    

Players on Vacation who did not vote:
  fon                                         
  Robert Sevin                                
  Pascal                                      

New players who are not active:
  Dagny                                       
  Tim                                         

====================================================
Wayne, your friendly Tabulator
====================================================

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 96 14:13:10 EDT 
From: [email-masked] ()
Subject: Ackanomic: Prop 1260 Fails

Here are the voting results for : 1260
  Proposal 1260 - Thu Sep 19 12:06:47 EDT 1996
  Trains
  snowgod  (Phil Ackley)

Quorum met : 22 eligible voters -- 15 players cast votes

4 YES votes   12 NO votes   1 PRESENT votes
Proposal FAILS

snowgod loses 7 points.  59 -> 52

4 YES votes:  3 point each
  Malenkai               FUN                   36 -> 39           
  Brinjal                                      27 -> 30           
  Guy Fawkes             (None Yet)            31 -> 34           
  mr cwm                 (None Yet)            13 -> 16           

12 NO votes:  
  ThinMan                Vulcan               =  27               
  Niccolo Flychuck       Vulcan               =  31               
  Bash                   Underworld           =  27               
  snowgod                (None Yet)           =  52               
  Habeous Corpus                              =  29               
  Vulcan Unity vote                           =   0               
  /dev/joe               Vulcan               =  20               
  Techno                 Underworld           =  18               
  IdiotBoy               Underworld           =   5               
  Underworld Unity vote                        =   0               
  Uncle Sam              Underworld           =  33               
  Wayne                  Underworld           =  29               

1 PRESENT votes:
  breadbox                                     =  18

7 ABSTENTIONS:
  Robin Hood                                  
  Bascule                FUN                  
  this is not a name     (None Yet)           
  Calvin N Hobbes        FUN                  
  fnord                                       
  skinny                                      
  Mohammed                                    

Players on Vacation who did not vote:
  fon                                         
  Robert Sevin                                
  Pascal                                      

New players who are not active:
  Tim                                         
  Dagny                                       

====================================================
Wayne, your friendly Tabulator
====================================================

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 1996 14:16:27 -0400 (EDT)
From: mr cwm <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Ackanomic: Prop 1249 Fails

I believe this was withdrawn.  I don't keep very good records, but I might
be able to come up with something on this one.

- -mr cwm
 wearing a Silly Vacation Hat

>Here are the voting results for : 1249
>  Proposal 1249 - Wed Sep 18 10:51:04 EDT 1996
>  Patent Infringement
>  mr cwm  (Eric Murray)
>

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 1996 20:36:34 +0200 (EET)
From: Uri Bruck <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Another new church

On Thu, 26 Sep 1996, Malenkai wrote:

> Guy Fawkes wrote:
> > 
> > Now that churches may soon have economic power though, what's to prevent
> > the same four people from forming twenty-odd churches to cash in many,
> > many times over?
> 
> The answer is: The proposal which attempts to give them economic power
> should account for the possibility of a player being in multiple
> churches, if "Freedom of Religion" passes.
> 
> Churches had no economic power, or even an RFC for one, when I submitted
> "Freedom of Religion".  In fact, they had no power by rule whatsoever
> when I submitted "Freedom of Religion".  My view of a church is that it

Actually I discussed the Synod in a proto-RFC, in a much reduced form,
before you submitted this. and you resonded to it. but that's just
nit-picking.

Otherwise I agree with your presentation of the situation. 
The RFC which would give Churches an economical role is incompatible with
the Freedom of Reilgion proposal.
As I've pointed out before. If that proposal passes, I will not propose
the Synod.  I may either try to re-think it, or propose another kind of
Organization to serve in that role, and keepthe Church as an Organization
with no role whatsoever. I'd prefer to  to do this with Church.

> Under that definition, "Freedom of Religion" makes sense.  Under 
> definitions which would make churches bureaucratic or economic powers,
> it may not.  I'm happy with churches the way they work now.  I'd like
> to participate in all of them where I share common ground with the
> dogma and thoughts of their members, just as I would in the real world.

I disagree with one thing as you present it. This has nothing to do with
power. Not everything in Ackanomic interacts in terms of power. I've
already discussed why I think an Institution like the RFCd Synod could be 
interesting to the game. I've introduced various checks and balances into
the RFC, and discussed some of them. But it has nothing to do with power.
It has to with another kind of interaction between players and
Organizations, between Organizations, and other Organizations. 
 
It is not necessary, but there is nothing bad about it either. 

>  I see no need to develop churches beyond what they are now.  It is 
> possible that such development will clash with "Freedom of Religion"
> and promote scams, if not done properly.  Acka can now decide which
> of these directions, if at all, churches can develop.

I see this as more than just about how Churches will develop, but also
about how Acka will develop. Are we interested in experimenting with some
of the things we've already built. Or are we forever going to construct
things which are never to be used.

Niccolo Flychuck

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 1996 14:00:52 -0500 (CDT)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <devjoe>
Subject: Re: Ackanomic: Prop 1249 Fails

mr cwm wrote:
> I believe this was withdrawn.  I don't keep very good records, but I might
> be able to come up with something on this one.

mr cwm is right.  He retracted P1249 and suffered the penalty for doing so
at 13:04 EDT on September 19.

/dev/joe
Scorekeeper

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 1996 14:10:39 -0500 (CDT)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <devjoe>
Subject: Re: Ackanomic: Prop 1253 Passes

> Here are the voting results for : 1253
>   Proposal 1253 - Wed Sep 18 11:21:13 EDT 1996
>   Tornado
>   Malenkai  (Randy Hall)

> 16 YES votes   4 NO votes   0 PRESENT votes
> Proposal PASSES

I congratulate Malenkai on having the only proposal to pass (so far) today.

This is a bigger occasion, however, because it is Malenkai's 100th
accepted proposal.  As his three Silver Stripes blink out of existence,
I award Malenkai his second Gold Stripe.

/dev/joe
Senator, /dev/senate3

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 1996 15:15:00 -0400
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Ackanomic: Prop 1253 Passes

Joseph W. DeVincentis wrote:
> 
> > Here are the voting results for : 1253
> >   Proposal 1253 - Wed Sep 18 11:21:13 EDT 1996
> >   Tornado
> >   Malenkai  (Randy Hall)
> 
> > 16 YES votes   4 NO votes   0 PRESENT votes
> > Proposal PASSES
> 
> I congratulate Malenkai on having the only proposal to pass (so far) today.
> 
> This is a bigger occasion, however, because it is Malenkai's 100th
> accepted proposal.

Thanks.  I'm actually excited about 100 proposals, I'll admit.  Given
the current climate, its amazing.

Fortunately, a proposal to end this tedious UW strike is already in the
queue.

Malenkai
bored

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 1996 15:23:38 -0400 (EDT)
From: mr cwm <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Ackanomic: Prop 1253 Passes

On Thu, 26 Sep 1996, /dev/joe wrote:

>> Here are the voting results for : 1253
>>   Proposal 1253 - Wed Sep 18 11:21:13 EDT 1996
>>   Tornado
>>   Malenkai  (Randy Hall)
>
>> 16 YES votes   4 NO votes   0 PRESENT votes
>> Proposal PASSES
>
>I congratulate Malenkai on having the only proposal to pass (so far) today.
>
>This is a bigger occasion, however, because it is Malenkai's 100th
>accepted proposal.  As his three Silver Stripes blink out of existence,
>I award Malenkai his second Gold Stripe.
>
>/dev/joe
>Senator, /dev/senate3
>

I would like to add my voice to /dev/joe's in congratulating Malenkai on
his 100th accepted proposal, and wonder aloud if he ever sleeps :)

- -mr cwm
 wearing a Silly Vacation Hat

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 1996 14:27:41 -0500 (CDT)
From: Guy Fawkes <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Ackanomic: Proposal 1278

But what if the current owner wants to keep the goose?  Sure, you may not 
be able to win the cycle if you have it, but I can see how the goose 
might grow on you -- you might name it, make a pet out of it, and...

Anyway, I think the current holder of the Goose should be allowed to 
interdict this transfer.

Guy Fawkes

On Thu, 26 Sep 1996 [email-masked] wrote:

> Proposal 1278 - Thu Sep 26 13:47:53 EDT 1996
> Flight of the Goose
> Malenkai  (Randy Hall)
> 
> Amend R 1067 to replace all occurrances of:
> 
>       "No player may enter Cow Town except as specified in this rule." 
> 
> With:
> 
>       "No player may enter Cow Town except as specified in this rule.
> Upon entering Cow Town, the guest shall have the Chartreuse Goose
> transferred to him or her from wherever it is."
> 
> 
> 

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 1996 15:27:35 -0400
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Ackanomic: Proposal 1278

Guy Fawkes wrote:

[in reference to P 1278]

> Anyway, I think the current holder of the Goose should be allowed to
> interdict this transfer.

That might make a good amendment.  The way Cow Town is written, however,
it is too wimpy.  I have just demonstrated how anyone can avoid any
Gaol sentence for A$25.  That has to be beefed up; it ruins game balance.

BTW, where are my legal fees?

Malenkai

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 1996 15:42:37 -0400
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: CFJ 299 Verdict

CFJ 299 has been judged TRUE.  The initiator shall win the cycle 4 days
from the date of this post, under current conditions.

Clerk of the Courts
- -------------------------------------------------------------------------
Call For Judgement 299
  Subject: Personally Glorious Paradox
Initiator: Guy Fawkes
    Judge: Calvin N Hobbes (selected Sep 24, 1996, 23:28h EDT)
Judgement: TRUE

Statement:

The legality of omitting a rule's originator's name from the
official copy of the official rules, if that rule was created before Rule
682 and the originator is unknown, cannot be determined with finality.

Guy Fawkes's Reasoning:

If this CFJ receives a final verdict of TRUE, Guy Fawkes will
win the cycle in accordance with R219.

Rule 682 -- "For Personal Glory..." (excerpts)

"a) The official copy of the official rules should include with the text
of each rule the name of the originator of the rule and the date the rule
was enacted.

a)1) The originator's name should appear just below the title of the
proposal and before the text of the proposal.

[...]

c) The requirements in (a) and (c) do not have to apply to rules created
before the enactment of this rule if such data is not known."

To properly understand this, we must examine the meaning of "do not have
to apply."  IMO, it means that under those circumstances, the
requirements are *optional* -- it is legal to follow them; it is also
legal to ignore them.  This is not a paradox by itself.  Instead of one
action being legal and illegal, it merely creates a situation where two
opposite actions are both legal.

However, section c) is self-referential -- The requirements in (a) and
(c) do not have to apply to rules created before...

Therefore, if the conditions and of being created befre R682 and being of
unknown originator are true, sections (a) and (c) are optional.

There is no problem with (a) being optional.

If (c), however, is optional, a paradox arises.  It becomes legal for the
requirements of (a) to be relaxed, which is the case of the option of (c)
being in effect; it is equally legal for the requirements of (a) to be
enforced, which is the case of the of (c) not being in effect -- in this
case, it is illegal to omit the originator's name.

Thus, (c)'s optional nature causes two equally valid game-states to
exist; one in which the originator's name on an early rule where it is
unknown must be included anyway, and one in which the originator's name
may be omitted in such circumstances -- one in which the omission is
illegal and one in which it is legal.

Paradox.

Calvin N Hobbes Reasoning:

The reasoning by Guy Fawkes is well explained. By making both (a) and itself
optional, (c), the claim is that on the "recursive layer" (if we can call it
that) then (a) is made a requirement again and thus there are two paths, one
legal, and one illegal.

R219/1 specifies that a paradox occurs when "the legality of some action
cannot be determined with finality". Finality there is not. It would seem
there is a typo in 682 and that in (c), it was going to be (a) and (b), not
(a) and (c) that should have been "excluded". This simple correction has
been sent.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 26 Sep 1996 15:53:09 -0400
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: CFJ 282 Appeal Verdict

The Supreme Court has overturned CFJ 282 to TRUE, with a penalty of
3 points to the original judge.

Some scores need to be retroactively updated as a result of P 1218.
The financal balances on the speaker page already account for this.

Sep 26 15:53 EDT: -3 bash: Overturn of CFJ 282

Clerk of the Courts
- -------------------------------------------------------------------------
Call For Judgement 282
  Subject: Proposal Bribery and Money Scrolls
Initiator: fnord
    Judge: Brinjal (failed to respond)
2nd Judge: Bash (selected Sep 15, 1996, 11:09h New York Time)
Judgement: FALSE
   Appeal: TRUE

Statement:

Proposal 1218 ("Scroll of Money") is an invalid proposal according to
Rule 793 ("No Proposal Bribery").

fnord's comments:

Rule 793 states that "a proposal is invalid if the rule change or resolution
discriminates in any way between players based on the way they vote on that
proposal."

Proposal 1218 creates an Ackanomic entity that would contain a list of
who "...voted for the proposal that created..." it.  The entity would then
transfer money from the Treasury to the players on that list.  This is most
certainly discrimination based on the way players may vote.

It may be pointed out by some that the phrase "vote for the proposal"
could be translated simply as any who voted on the proposal, whether
they voted "YES" or "NO".  This however, still discriminates against
those who abstain (either on purpose or through inaction) or chose not
to vote for Quorum reasons, both of which are certainly valid "ways
to vote".

Bash's Reasoning:

When talking about invalidating a proposal, Rule 793 talks about "the rule
change or resolution it contains". Well, I couldn't find any specific
definition for "rule change", so I must adopt the straight forward English
meaning, according to which creating a new rule is not a rule change
(furthermore, I found throughout the rules several times the phrase "new rule
or rule change" which supports my interpretation). Since Proposal 1218 is
about a new rule, not about a rule change, it is not invalid (according to
Rule 793).

However, the second half of rule 793 (which actually doesn't sit well with
the first half), means that even if Proposal 1218 passes, it won't have the
effect it states, which IMHO makes this proposal useless, and I would expect
Wayne to retract it.

Sorry if I was too "clever".

Bash (WOW ! It is tough being a judge !)

Appeal Reasoning:

I note to Bash that if he has a web browser available then /dev/joe's
list of the Rules by categories is extremely useful.  In particular,
under the "Proposals and Rule Changes" category you will find rule
491, "What is a Rule Change?"

You can find the link to the afforementioned list of the Rules by
categories on the main web page.

You are right, though, it _is_ tough to be a judge.

Supreme Court's Reasoning:

The Court agrees with the Appealer that P1218 is, in
fact, a proposed rule change according to R491, and thus is invalid
according to R793.

Penalty to the original judge:

3 points.

------------------------------

End of Ackanomic Digest V1 #262
*******************************