Subject: Ackanomic Digest V1 #153
From: [email-masked] (Ackanomic Digest)
To: ackanomic-digest

Ackanomic Digest       Saturday, August 3 1996       Volume 01 : Number 153

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Date: Fri, 2 Aug 96 23:23:18 EDT 
From: [email-masked] ()
Subject: Ackanomic: Proposal 1066

Proposal 1066 - Fri Aug 02 23:23:18 EDT 1996
Revising Revision Numbers
/dev/joe  (Joseph DeVincentis)

Amend rule 822, "Revision Numbers, Defined" by changing the title to
"Revision Numbers" and changing the text to read, in full:

In addition to its effective ordinal number, each rule has a revision
number.  Rule numbers may be written as X/R; in any such construction, X is
the effective ordinal number and R is the revision number.

Each rule's revision number is equal to the number of times that rule has
been changed, since its creation, except that changes due to the Spelling
Bee or due to the deletion of specially delimited text, or due to the rule
amending itself, shall not be counted, and if a proposal changes a rule in
more than one way [such as transmuting a rule, amending it, and then
transmuting it again] then this counts as only one change.

{{[ This creates more work for me in the short term, but makes some things
easier later, and reduces the ugliness that occurs after an immutable
rule has been trans-amend-trans-ed. ]}}

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 2 Aug 96 23:24:17 EDT 
From: [email-masked] ()
Subject: Ackanomic: Prop 1052 Fails

Here are the voting results for : 1052
  Proposal 1052 - Thu Jul 25 14:11:46 EDT 1996
  snowgod's blizzard
  snowgod  (Phil Ackley)

Quorum met : 12 eligible voters -- 11 players cast votes

4 YES votes   8 NO votes   0 PRESENT votes
Proposal FAILS

snowgod loses 9 points.  12 -> 3

4 YES votes:  1 point each
  Bascule                FUN                   46 -> 47           
  snowgod                (None Yet)             3 -> 4            
  Techno                 Underworld            49 -> 50           
  mr cwm                 (None Yet)            30 -> 31           

8 NO votes:  
  Robin Hood                                  =  22               
  Malenkai               FUN                  = 166               
  Brinjal                                     =  17               
  ThinMan                                     =  24               
  this is not a name     (None Yet)           =  69               
  Habeous Corpus                              =  16               
  /dev/joe                                    = 163               
  Wayne                  Underworld           = -24               

0 PRESENT votes:

1 ABSTENTIONS:
  De'ghew                Underworld           

Players on Vacation who did not vote:
  fon                                         
  Mellon                                      
  chess piece face       Foozball             
  Niccolo Flychuck                            
  Simon Marty Harriman   Foozball             
  Calvin N Hobbes        FUN                  
  Foozball Unity vote                         
  Robert Sevin           Foozball             
  Pascal                                      

New players who are not active:

====================================================
Wayne, your friendly Tabulator
====================================================

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 2 Aug 1996 19:47:27 -0800
From: [email-masked] (Phil Ackley)
Subject: Re: Ackanomic: Proposal 1065

At 11:23 PM 8/2/96, [email-masked] () wrote:
>Proposal 1065 - Fri Aug 02 23:23:16 EDT 1996
>Blue Cross Automation
>/dev/joe  (Joseph DeVincentis)

I strongly object to this proposal, and any others along these lines
(automation).  Part of the fun of ackanomic is "Roleplaying" and I believe
many players enjoy the ceremony that goes with a blue cross award, or
anything else similar.

If a no political officers choose to award a Blue Cross to a player, there
is probably a reason for that.  If a player deserves a Blue Cross he will
most likely get one - without having to resort to automation.

>{{[ This proposal intentionally does not give fon a Blue Cross Bonus,
>since he did little to merit such an award.  Section v is mainly to
>give me a Blue Cross Bonus because my term as President will end
>before the proposal passes.  Section i is to close what I am now going
>to call "Malenkai's loophole" -- due to his treatment of Bronze Torches.
>Section ii-iv handle the other blue crosses which have been given to
>past presidents and senators and by Rule 1044.]}}

Since the rules state that fon is eligible for a Blue Cross, and since I
chose to award him one, it seems rather unfair to deny him that cross
regardless of the fact that he has done little to deserve it.  If no cross
had been awarded him prior to this proposal (though he was eligible) I
woudn't object.

snowgod

Ackanomic Ambassador - Liason to Internomic - Stuck in the Gaol for a Week
Inventor -Senator (seat a) - Heretic (4 times!) - Former CSRR
Founder, Church of the Markovian Dream - Member, None Yet
Wearing a prosthetic forehead - Fighting Forehead Discrimination

"Make it idiot-proof, and someone will make a better idiot"

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 2 Aug 1996 19:51:45 -0800
From: [email-masked] (Phil Ackley)
Subject: Acka: Let Me Out!!! 

Okay,

let's look at this situation from another oint of view...

Our illustrious president, /dev/joe, issued Malenkai a pardon for a heinous
crime, on the grounds that the rule which Malenkai was guilty of violation
had been repealed.

The same president refuses to grant me a pardon, so I remain locked up in
the Gaol for a crime that I was deemed never to have commited in the first
place.

Seems a little absurd, eh?

snowgod

Ackanomic Ambassador - Liason to Internomic - Stuck in the Gaol for a Week
Inventor -Senator (seat a) - Heretic (4 times!) - Former CSRR
Founder, Church of the Markovian Dream - Member, None Yet
Wearing a prosthetic forehead - Fighting Forehead Discrimination

"Make it idiot-proof, and someone will make a better idiot"

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 2 Aug 96 23:52:57 -0400
From: this is not a name <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: CFCJ 110 (De'ghew)

>Player this is not a name has violated R101
>
>snowgod's Reasoning:
>
>By recieving no salary for his duties as acting gaoler, this is not a name
>has violated rule 609 section iv (per rule 712 (gaoler, creation of), and
>in doing so, violated R101.

This is absurd. I am not in charge of giving myself a salary or not. If 
anyone, the Financier is responsible.

- --      Mike Epstein            "There used to be a real me,
      [email-masked]           but I had it surgically removed."
  *                      *                       --Peter Sellers
http://www.nyiq.net/~epstein/   

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 2 Aug 96 23:55:01 -0400
From: this is not a name <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Official

Habeous Corpus wrote:
>>You can't. You're not a member of it.
>
>Yeah, but the Church Elder is in Gaol,  so e can't throw me out.

That doesn't matter; you still never joined the church. Only church 
members are eligible to run to their churches.

- --      Mike Epstein            "What a waste it is to lose one's mind,
      [email-masked]           or not to have a mind is being very
  *                      *       wasteful. How true that is."
http://www.nyiq.net/~epstein/        --Dan Quayle at an NAACP luncheon

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 2 Aug 1996 19:57:17 -0800
From: [email-masked] (Phil Ackley)
Subject: Re: Acka: CFCJ 110 (De'ghew)

>>Player this is not a name has violated R101
>>
>>snowgod's Reasoning:
>>
>>By recieving no salary for his duties as acting gaoler, this is not a name
>>has violated rule 609 section iv (per rule 712 (gaoler, creation of), and
>>in doing so, violated R101.
>
>This is absurd. I am not in charge of giving myself a salary or not. If
>anyone, the Financier is responsible.

Regarless, you have broken the rules and shall be punished (I hope, I
hope).  You should have paid more attention to the rules and tried to fix
this problem, but no, you happily accepted recieveing no salary.  But if it
makes you feel any better, you will be spending time in the Gaol with
ThinMan.  Perhaps  our Gaoler will give you two cells close to each other
so that you will have time to discuss your mistakes.

  I'm in a vendetta kinda mood :)

snowgod

Ackanomic Ambassador - Liason to Internomic - Stuck in the Gaol for a Week
Inventor -Senator (seat a) - Heretic (4 times!) - Former CSRR
Founder, Church of the Markovian Dream - Member, None Yet
Wearing a prosthetic forehead - Fighting Forehead Discrimination

"Make it idiot-proof, and someone will make a better idiot"

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 02 Aug 1996 23:56:37 -0400
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Ackanomic: Proposal 1065

Phil Ackley wrote:
> 
> At 11:23 PM 8/2/96, [email-masked] () wrote:
> >Proposal 1065 - Fri Aug 02 23:23:16 EDT 1996
> >Blue Cross Automation
> >/dev/joe  (Joseph DeVincentis)
> 
> I strongly object to this proposal, and any others along these lines
> (automation).  Part of the fun of ackanomic is "Roleplaying" and I believe
> many players enjoy the ceremony that goes with a blue cross award, or
> anything else similar.

> If a no political officers choose to award a Blue Cross to a player, there
> is probably a reason for that.  If a player deserves a Blue Cross he will
> most likely get one - without having to resort to automation.

From the actual proposal:

> Any time a player has too few of any of these medals, the
> President, Proconsul, or Senator may award medals of the appropriate types
> to that player until he has enough of each type. 

This proposal went through RFC, at which time I made the same objection.
/dev/joe added the preceeding to the RFC version, which I am satisfied
accomplishes the common sense that /dev/joe (and I) desired, and preserved
the flavor that I wished preserved.

This proposal kicked around between /dev/joe and myself a bit, and then 
kicked around RFC.  I encourage players to get more involved in the RFC
process, if possible.  At least that is how this rewrite captured the
ideas the two of us wanted, in a compatable way.

Malenkai

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 2 Aug 1996 23:07:52 -0500 (CDT)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <devjoe>
Subject: Acka: Spelling Bee (CFCJ 110)

The Spelling Bee is flying!

In snowgod's Reasoning on CFCJ 110, he wrote:
> R609 section iv reads:
   [...]
>               of the Office.  For any given Seat, there can be an
>               "Acting" Officer only if the Seat is vacant.penalty:
> 
> Suggested Penalty:

Change the word "vacant.penalty:" to "vacant".

A longer list of Spelling Bee changes will come as soon as I catch up on
current stuff.

/dev/joe
Web-Harfer

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 2 Aug 1996 23:11:59 -0500 (CDT)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <devjoe>
Subject: Acka: Spelling Bee (CFCJ 111)

The Spelling Bee is still flying!

On CFCJ 111, make the same change:  "vacant.penalty:" is changed to
"vacant."

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 2 Aug 1996 23:17:36 -0500 (CDT)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <devjoe>
Subject: Acka: Presidentness: AFP

I hereby grant snowgod's Appeal for Pardon.
He has been in Gaol long enough.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 3 Aug 1996 05:10:09 GMT
From: Simon Clarke <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Ackanomic: Prop 1043 Passes

Jailbird Snowgod wrote :
> [Banging on the walls with my little tin coffe cup]
> 
> Hey!  Hey hey! Mr Gaoler?
> 
Alright alright, what's all this noise? What's your problem, you have
a nice damp little cell. A great view from the window too. If you
stand on your bunk, stretch to the left and crane you head round
you can just make out the corner of the senate building.

> What kinda bribe are we looking at here?

Bribe? Well you could always try greasing my palm and see what happens!
In the meantime here's something to read [hands Snowgod copy of CFJ
258]. By my reckoning it would be illegal to respond to it whilst in
Gaol, but I am willing to take legal advice on that...

Brinjal
(Gaoler)

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 3 Aug 96 00:18:23 -0400
From: this is not a name <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: CFCJ 110 (De'ghew)

>Player this is not a name has violated R101
>
>snowgod's Reasoning:
>
>By recieving no salary for his duties as acting gaoler, this is not a name
>has violated rule 609 section iv (per rule 712 (gaoler, creation of), and
>in doing so, violated R101.

I was Acting Gaoler because I was Appointer. Serving as Acting Gaoler was 
a duty of my job as Appointer. I did indeed receive a salary as 
Appointer, which included my duties as Acting Gaoler. Therefore I did not 
receive no salary.

- --      Mike Epstein            "I stopped believing in Santa Claus when
      [email-masked]           I was six. Mother took me to see him in 
  *                      *       a department store and he asked for my
http://www.nyiq.net/~epstein/    autograph."      --Shirley Temple Black

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 2 Aug 1996 23:23:47 -0500 (CDT)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <devjoe>
Subject: Re: Acka: Nomination for Senate

Malenkai wrote:
> I note there was some debate between myself and the Appointer as to
> the "appropriate" officer to conduct the nomination.  I agree with
> tinan that it is the Speaker.  If anyone cares:
> 
> R 478:
> R 576:
> R 611:
> R 614: Appointer:
  [various rule text deleted]

> Appointer does not claim to be the "appropriate" officer for conduction
> nomination for a political office, leaving "appropriate" undefined,

> I render "appropriate" as undefined, and thus unspecified in this case.
> Anyone want to claim an "indeterminacy" CFJ?

Actually, this is now the Assistant Tabulator's job (still Malenkai's job,
though).  See rule 414.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 03 Aug 1996 00:22:36 -0400
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: CFJ 252 Verdict

CFJ 252 has been judged TRUE.

Clerk of the Courts

Call For Judgement 252
  Subject: Contracts III
Initiator: ThinMan
    Judge: /dev/joe (declined to judge)
2nd Judge: Malekai (selected Aug 02, 1996, 19:42h New York Time)

Statement:

No contract has legal authority to directly cause any transfer of currency,
although it may require players to transfer currency among themselves.

ThinMan's Reasoning:

Currency is protected, so may not be manipulated except as the Rules specify.
No Rule allows a contract to transfer currency in any way.  Rule 514 may
allow a contract to "require" one player to transfer currency to another,
but the contract itself may not perform such a transfer.

Malenkai's Reasoning:

ThinMan's reasoning is unassailable.  The statement on which judgement
was called is TRUE.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 03 Aug 1996 00:24:11 -0400
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Presidentness: AFP

Joseph W. DeVincentis wrote:
> 
> I hereby grant snowgod's Appeal for Pardon.
> He has been in Gaol long enough.

Booooooo!!

Put him back!

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 3 Aug 96 00:28:28 -0400
From: this is not a name <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Nomination for Senate

/dev/joe wrote:
>> I render "appropriate" as undefined, and thus unspecified in this case.
>> Anyone want to claim an "indeterminacy" CFJ?
>
>Actually, this is now the Assistant Tabulator's job (still Malenkai's job,
>though).  See rule 414.

That's just soliciting votes. It doesn't mention soliciting nominations.

- --      Mike Epstein            "To move the [elevator] cabin, push button
      [email-masked]           of wishing floor. If the cabin should 
  *                      *       enter more persons, each one should
http://www.nyiq.net/~epstein/    push the number of wishing floor. Driving
                                 is then going alphabetically by natural
order. Button retaining pressed position shows received command for 
visiting station."                          --Directions in a Madrid hotel

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 2 Aug 1996 20:29:42 -0800
From: [email-masked] (Phil Ackley)
Subject: Re: Acka: Presidentness: AFP

At 11:17 PM 8/2/96, Joseph W. DeVincentis wrote:
>I hereby grant snowgod's Appeal for Pardon.
>He has been in Gaol long enough.

Thank you.  However, I would like to see it acknowledged that I should
never have been in the Gaol at all since the supreme court overturned CFCJ
107.  Good thing you released me... I was about to form the commitiee to
free the political prisoners :)

snowgod

Ackanomic Ambassador - Liason to Internomic - Stuck in the Gaol for a Week
Inventor -Senator (seat a) - Heretic (4 times!) - Former CSRR
Founder, Church of the Markovian Dream - Member, None Yet
Wearing a prosthetic forehead - Fighting Forehead Discrimination

"Make it idiot-proof, and someone will make a better idiot"

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 2 Aug 1996 20:29:54 -0800
From: [email-masked] (Phil Ackley)
Subject: Re: Acka: CFCJ 110 (De'ghew)

>
>I was Acting Gaoler because I was Appointer. Serving as Acting Gaoler was
>a duty of my job as Appointer. I did indeed receive a salary as
>Appointer, which included my duties as Acting Gaoler. Therefore I did not
>receive no salary.

That's stretching it.  Your salary as appointer was paid to you
specifically for the duties of that job.  The fact that were required as a
duty of one job to assume the duties (and not the privlidges) of a second
job does not mean that the pay is also occuring for the second job.  All
monies paid to you were in payment for your duties as appointer.  So,
though you can argue it all you want, you did recieve no salary for being
acting-gaoler.

snowgod

Ackanomic Ambassador - Liason to Internomic - Stuck in the Gaol for a Week
Inventor -Senator (seat a) - Heretic (4 times!) - Former CSRR
Founder, Church of the Markovian Dream - Member, None Yet
Wearing a prosthetic forehead - Fighting Forehead Discrimination

"Make it idiot-proof, and someone will make a better idiot"

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 03 Aug 1996 00:34:28 -0400
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: Nomination for Senate

Joseph W. DeVincentis wrote: 

[handling nominations]

> Actually, this is now the Assistant Tabulator's job (still Malenkai's job,
> though).  See rule 414.

To handle the *nomination* process, as opposed to the *election* process.
I cannot see how you render that from R 414, but I've gotten 3 hours
sleep the past few nights.

Malenkai

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 2 Aug 1996 23:39:12 -0500 (CDT)
From: "Joseph W. DeVincentis" <devjoe>
Subject: Re: Acka: Nomination for Senate

tinan wrote:
> /dev/joe wrote:
> >> I render "appropriate" as undefined, and thus unspecified in this case.
> >> Anyone want to claim an "indeterminacy" CFJ?
> >
> >Actually, this is now the Assistant Tabulator's job (still Malenkai's job,
> >though).  See rule 414.

> That's just soliciting votes. It doesn't mention soliciting nominations.

Oh, you're right.  The Speaker handles the nominations, and the assistant
tabulator handles the votes.  Whee.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 03 Aug 1996 00:38:11 -0400
From: Malenkai <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Acka: CFCJ 110 (De'ghew)

Phil Ackley wrote:
> 
> >
> >I was Acting Gaoler because I was Appointer. Serving as Acting Gaoler was
> >a duty of my job as Appointer. I did indeed receive a salary as
> >Appointer, which included my duties as Acting Gaoler. Therefore I did not
> >receive no salary.
> 
> That's stretching it. 

CFCJ 110 is absolutely absurd and without merit.  Would the Postmaster
please create acka-bandwidthwaste@wilma ... so this discussion can continue
elsewhere :0)

Malenkai
(laughing) (and Enlightened, along with tinan)

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 3 Aug 96 00:57:14 -0400
From: this is not a name <[email-masked]>
Subject: Acka: Official: File Clerk

It is my understanding that both outstanding contracts have been 
destroyed.

Malenkai's contract with ThinMan was destroyed when /dev/joe went on 
vacation and therefore became unable to vote on proposals.

My contract with /dev/joe was deemed illegal and thus non-Enforceable and 
thus destroyed when CFJ 252 was returned.

this is not a name
File Clerk

- --      Mike Epstein            
      [email-masked]          Don't have a battle of wits
  *                      *      with an unarmed opponent.
http://www.nyiq.net/~epstein/   

------------------------------

End of Ackanomic Digest V1 #153
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